ShadowShooter
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Posts
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Posts posted by ShadowShooter
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This BATF letter dated two years ago that I found online states that NFA items (such as SBS) are still subject to 922®:
That letter is crap. "Less than 10 imported parts." HAHA It's 10 or less, not nine.
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Hi rhane71,
texas skeeter is correct. Have fun...
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Yes ... under a certain interpretation, it's all good.
Perhaps under Matt Damon's interpretation.
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Wait...aren't the non-telescoping & telescoping versions the EXACT SAME PARTS? The only difference is the milled recoil tube, which is part of the receiver! How the **** does it count both ways?
It doesn't. 14 part count for the M4 with a separate pistol grip and a separate buttstock, irrespective of whether it is collapsible or not.
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Hey ShadowShooter and Hookster,
Would you guys mind posting your response letters also? It would probably be good for everyone to see the consistency in the responses from the ATF as well as any differences in the answers that they may have given.
Sure as soon as I get my scanner up and running again...
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Thanks for the update Shadow!
Hookster
Pleasure.. Thanks for the SOCOM 16 post. I shot that hog the other day. That thing is sick!!!
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Upon reading this logic, I consider the Benelli M4S90 firearm to be a single item (It has a single serial # and is identified as such. A single item.) containing a combination of multiple parts. Screw your 922r.
I said the pertinent part of the letter Jr.. They clearly note the M4 shotgun is not a single item. I was thinking why put that in there only an idiot would argue that.
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Just got my letter back today. The two gas pistons on the M4 only count as one imported part.
The pertinent part of the letter states, "where a single item contains a combination of multiple "parts," it still shall only count as one item. The A.R.G.O. counts as one part."
Sound familiar? The one piece non-telescoping pistol grip buttstock is a single item which contains a combination of multiple "parts," which is why it only counts as one item.
ATF responses are consistent. 13 part count for the M4 with the standard field buttstock/ one piece non-telescoping pistol grip buttstock. 14 part count for the M4 with a separate pistol grip and a separate buttstock.
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"Boeshield T-9 is a heavy-duty, rust and corrosion preventive developed by The Boeing Company for lubrication and protection of aircraft components. Specially formulated combination of solvents, waxes and lubricants coats and protects smooth and porous metals from rust and corrosion. Displaces moisture and lubricates at the same time. Dries to a thin, waxy film that will not harm paints, plastics and vinyls. Not easily removed once dried; requires mineral spirits or degreaser. For firearms applications requiring better than average protection against moisture indoors and outdoors. Good choice for long-term exposure to salt-air environments, areas with high humidity or extreme wetness. Available in 4 oz. and 1 gal. containers, 4 oz. and 12 oz. spray aerosol cans."
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Hey All,
Does anyone know if the Winchester Military Grade 12ga 00 buckshot pictured here is lead or steel shot?
I just got some and assumed it was lead but just read a post on another site saying that military 12 ga.shells were steel. I've also seen some conflicting info on velocity. Midway USA (where I got it from) says it's 1325 and on the Cabela's site it says 1450. Does anyone have much experience with this stuff and have an opinion on it? good/bad/average?
Thanks,
Hookster
It's lead and it's average.
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No need to appologize because I really appreciate the input from all of you. Basically I was just trying to figure out if the modified choke deformed the FC wad or if it passes through ok.
Another day + more rounds produced a different result. I went to the range yesterday with 27 rounds of Federal LE127 instead of just six and took the shots at 10, 15 and 25 yards with a cyl, mod and full choke. The cyl and mod choke produced tighter patterns (no significant difference between those two) than the full. It appears the mod choke did not deform the FC wad in any way, shape or form. The full on the other hand, seemed to do just that; at least with my gun and on this occasion.
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hey SHADOW SHOOTER, do you know what yr the AG made this 922/10 parts law? what im getting at is, could i have owned my m4 w/ collapsible stock before this law? thanks skeeter
1993.. If you bought your M4 with the collapsible stock attached you're GTG as 922® only applies to the assembly of parts not mere possession, which is one reason why you see such a premium for M4s w/ collapsible stocks and/or full length mag tubes on gunbroker.com et al.
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So essentially, the configuration of the Limited Edition M1014 may have 14 parts according to ATF analysis counting the pistol grip and stock separately.
Yup and that's assuming MeanGreen's letter is correct and you only count the dual gas pistons as one.
As I understand it though, there is some other way to "register" the gun legally in any configuration I wanted right? I've been told that you can get a "short barrel" registration which allows you to modify the gun however you want? Anyone that can explain this in more detail?That has nothing to do with 922®.
Q: Now that the AWB (assault weapons ban) has expired, am I allowed to remove the 1 position recoil tube currently on my limited edition M1014 and replace it with a 3 position tube?The AG has stated the collapsible stock is not suitable or readily adaptable for sporting purposes which is why the M4 is not imported that way to the general public; therefore if you want to assemble the 3 position tube (so your two piece would then be collapsible) you have to drop to 10 parts or less. Unfortunately in the here and the now there are not enough USA made parts to assemble the three position tube and be complaint with 922®.
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I was just out playing with some Federal 00 Buck with the FC wad seeing how good they really are. So far I have just used the IC choke and was curious if anyone has ran these through a MOD choke and if so did the FC wad still do it's job.
Yup and it does its job through a standard Full choke as well. I never shot it through a .665 as the Tec from Federal stated you get the best results from a standard full. However, I did not notice any difference in my patterns with a Cyl, Mod or Full choke at my "max" HD range of 10 yards. At 30 yards the Full produced a slightly smaller pattern than the Cyl and Mod choke.
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Because the Benelli M4 is the sickest looking, softest-kicking, most reliable and accurate tactical shotgun available to the public today.
Plus, it makes an excellent zombie killer...
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Next, it is almost dove season again, and I would just get a total kick out of using my M4 for dove hunting. Unfortunatly in my state the limit is 1 in the chamber and a maximum of 2 in the tube, with a physical limiter ensuring no more than two. Does benelli or anyone else make a two round limiter for the M4?
Here is a two round magazine limiter plug for your M4. Although it states it fits the Nova 12, it works just as well with the M4 (so I have been told). Additionally, the 3 shot standard magazine plug description is taken in full and not in part; meaning it's a total of 3 shots, one in the chamber, two in the magazine. Unfortunately it is on backorder until mid September.
(Copy and paste into your web browser)
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=6463/Product/PLUG__3_SHOT__STANDARD_MAGAZINE
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Sorry to be so uneducated about gun laws, I'm new, and trying to learn as much as possible as quickly as I can, and you all have been very helpful--thank you--, but why does a collapsible stock make a difference??. If it's made by Benelli for an M4, why is that different than the standard pistol grip stock, as far as number of imported parts is concerned; or is there another factor involved?
Because the collapsible stock has two separate parts. Additionally, the collapsible stock is not generally recognized as particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes. The fixed one piece pistol grip stock on the other hand is suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes, which is why the M4 is imported that way.
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It's not the defendant's "burdon of proof" to show that something is US made; it just helps to have proof if there is a need to defend one's self from litigation.
Where did I hear that before? Oh yeah,
Found it.. Number 5 -
I would hope it would be enough to show "due diligence" towards the issue. If you have a link to the letter your talking about or could get it posted, that would be great.
I figure the more of their paper that backs us up the better.
Take Care,
Hookster
Found it.. Number 5
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No, it's not marked but I printed copies of the webpage with the Made in USA logo for the item. I also e-mailed their help desk asking specifically if the item was US made and I printed the e=mail with their response. I'll keep these pages with the invoice for the item and I did the same with the KZ rail (although it is marked "USA")
Hookster
Sounds good. According to a letter from the ATF I saw a few weeks ago addressing this issue, it looks like your pages with the invoice would be all that was needed in idenifying the origin of manufacture. I would post it, but don't know how.
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If you have a FL tube, buy a field-stock. Or get rid of the tube.
Those are your 2 options at this time. End of discussion pretty much.
Are you sure an imported shotgun with a standard field stock that has a magazine capacity greater than 5 rounds (FL Tube) is generally recognized as particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes?
Last I heard the AG went with the notion that traditional sporting shotguns generally contain magazines that have a capacity of 3-5 rounds. This would still seem to hold true as MeanGreen's letter stated "shotguns having a magazine capacity greater then 5 rounds are currently prohibited from importation..." Removing one of the so called "evil features" (pistol grip) is moot as that law expired and has nothing to do with 922®.
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Why not? That would replace three of the listed 13 imported parts with U.S. made parts which would bring you to 10 imported parts. Are you thinking about gas piston vs gas piston(s) ?
Hookster
MeanGreen's 13 part count letter applied to the one piece fixed pistol grip buttstock. Texas skeeter has the two piece buttstock.
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Hey Skeeter,
Assuming the 13 part count. A U.S made mag tube, a U.S. made follower and a U.S made forearm like a Surefire or KZ would make you 922R compliant.
Hookster
No it would not.
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does anyone make a recoil 3-position tube in the us? thanks skeeter
Even if someone did, it would not matter regarding 922®.
stippled m4 forend?
in Benelli
Posted
[ATTACH=CONFIG]2208[/ATTACH] Stippling provided by Lane at Cold Bore Customs.