frolic1
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Posts posted by frolic1
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HDS, I note you said you would like a versatile gun and you would like to shoot some clays. Well the M4 is NOT versatile, it is purely tactical. I have both a M4 and a Benelli Vinci. I've use the Vinci for trap, 5 stand, skeet and it was great. I tried the M4 once for clays. Yes it worked but it was not nearly as good or easy as the Vinci. With the ghost ring sight it is just not that easy to hit flying objects. Shooting clays is not what the M4 was designed to do. Also it does not cycle very light loads. The M4 was much better at shooting slugs at targets 50 - 100 meters away. If you want a really versatile shotgun that can shoot everything from 7/8 oz 2 3/4 inch shells to 2 oz. 3.5 inch shells consider the Beretta A400. Or if you never want to shoot 3.5 inch shells Beretta is making a A400 "Lite" which only shoots 2 3/4 and 3 inch shells, like the M4. And the Beretta is a few hundred dollars less than the M4. Finally the M4 comes with a magazine which holds 5 rounds (5 +1). A full length tube holds 7 + 1 but you would have to spend another ~$200.
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What's the purpose of a choke tube? To tighten up the spread of the shot. Since you only have "one shot" with a slug a cylinder choke should work fine. (After all do rifles use choke tubes?) Definitely do NOT use any choke greater than a MOD choke. I had excellent groupings with a improved cylinder choke shooting slugs with my M4 yesterday shooting Remington rifled slugs at 50 yards. Interesting, switching to Federal True Balls rifled slugs moved the grouping up 1 foot and spread them out a little more. So I'd recommend using your most open choke and try various different slugs to see which works the best.
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Really??? The full length tube is around 6 inches longer. So you're saying that a spring designed for 5 shells would work fine in a mag tube designed for 7 shells. It may or may not. In either case the tension on the spring for the 7th shell has to be less. When I got my Carriercomp full length tube it came with a longer spring. Why? A thread on this topic explained why a longer spring should be used. Basically several posts complained about the last shell not loading. In either case if yours works now will it work as well as the correct spring after a few years? I'd rather not take that chance.
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No one mentioned the mag spring. If you get the full length titanium tube you get the correct spring with it at the same time. If you get the mag extension you should also get a longer spring which may or may not be included. Just make sure what ever way you go you get the correct spring. Otherwise, if you use your original spring, the last round may not load.
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Just came back from the range where I shot slugs with my M4. At 50 yards I was able to hit an 8 inch target most of the time with about 1 in 4 within 2 inches of the bulls eye. Obviously this is a deadly accurate weapon using slugs going 1500 fps. Which got me thinking. Since this gun is used by the Marines, what kind of ammo do the marines use? Does it vary depending on mission? For HD I use 00 buck (Remington low recoil, 1200 fps) with a cylinder choke. Too wimpy???
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Shot trap once with my M4. Could only hit 1-2 out of 5. Did much better with my Vinci. I found that the sights (both front and rear) often blocked the clay. It was much easier with just the front bead on the barrel.
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I've had no problem with loading 7 Remington 00BK shells in my carrier comp mag tube.
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Yes, it's still for sale.
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I should have said similar in price. I know it's a great HD gun but I also have a Walther P99 which should do the job without blowing the house apart. I would have more use for something like a SBE II.
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M4 purchased in Sept. 2009, lightly used for target shooting. Includes Carriercomp titanium full length mag tube (7 +1), carrying case, MOD and skeet choke tubes. Excellent condition. $1500, SE Florida. Pics on request. Would consider a trade for a similar quality shotgun with a 28" barrel which would be better for skeet/trap.
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I have both a Vinci and a M4. Obviously the Vinci is easier to clean but that is kind of irrelevant. For HD/tactical the M4 is the way to go. If you want to shoot clays/birds then go with the Vinci. The Vinci was never designed for tactical use. According to the Vinci owners manual longer and full length mags are available but I've never seen one. Also keep in mind that having a HD gun sitting in a corner for that home invasion which will, hopefully never come, is no fun. A Vinci which you can also use for skeet/trap/clays (fun use) also works for HD if you keep it loaded next to the bed.
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Alfred, back to your original questions. I think you're primarily concerned about home defense. Correct? Slugs work fine with the M4 but I would change the standard MOD choke to a cylinder or improved cylinder and, of course used rifled slugs. Slugs do have a couple of problems. The recoil is higher (gases cannot escape around the shot), and they really mess up the barrel. They can coat the inside with lead "foil" which is hard to get out. My recommendation is Remmington 00 BK "Managed Recoil" shells. The recoil is less allowing for faster, more accurate follow up shots, and they still pack quite a punch. Also you can continue to use the standard MOD choke. Just my opinion.
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If the M2 recoil is too much try using lighter recoil shells. The M2 is a vast improvement over the 870. That being said, the 870 is a pump gun and you can use much lower recoil shells like Winlight. My M4 needs enough energy from the shells to properly cycle and I'm sure he M2 is similar. 1 oz load, 1200 fps shells will cycle these guns and the recoil is much less. For HD try Remmington 00 BK Managed Recoil shells.
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Shot several boxes of slugs through my M4. Afterwords, when cleaning I couldn't get the lead deposits (foil?) out of the barrel. I was just using Rem Action cleaner and a tampon which worked fine for bird shot in the past. Do I need to get a stainless steel brush? Which is the best solvent?
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That's what I'm asking, what are my options? I'm sure several people on this forum have mounted laser sights on their M4. I just don't want something big and heavy hanging off the side. I have a Crimson Trace laser grip on my Bersa pistol (LG 442) and it works just great. Something close to that for the M4 would be ideal.
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What are the options for a laser sight on an M4. I'm looking for something small and not to intrusive and requires constant pressure to keep on.
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You're correct, I was placing the dot over the bullseye and centering in the ghost ring. However, if I just dropped the ghost ring a few clicks wouldn't the POI drop to match the dot location?
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Shot slugs through my M4 yesterday for the 1st time. The grouping was about 6 - 12 inches high at 50 yards. I didn't have a screwdriver with me to adjust the elevation. When I got home I noticed that the adjustment screw had "click indentations" as it is turned. Does anyone know how many inches per "click" @ 50 yards the elevation adjustment makes?
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I have a new M4 "Super 90" but it's the typical M4 so I assume it's the same for M1's. As far as using your M1 for Skeet, trap, clays, don't worry about barrel length. At 20-50 yards it makes little difference assuming you're comfortable with the gun and it's a good fit. What does make a difference is chokes and sights. My M4 has a ghost ring sight which is great for targets but not so good for flying things. As far as chokes there is a lot of info in the web. Just google shotgun chokes and you'll find out all you need to know.
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I have experienced the same miss fires on my new Vinci on the 1st shell two times the last time I used it. And I too am new to semi-autos. Both times I held onto the bolt handle as I pushed the bolt closing button so as to not slam the shell into the chamber. After manually cycling the shell, shells 2-4 went off fine. I After the 2nd missfire I realized that the bolt was not completely all the way forward in it's correct seated position. After that I never held onto the bolt handle as I pushed the release button and had no more miss fires. I have a box of heavy load shells, 1 1/2 oz, magnum load which I'm going to fire to help completely break it in.
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My M4 came with a MOD choke. I also have a Trulock "Skeet" choke which I have to believe is equivalent to Improved cylinder. Would it be best to use the "skeet" choke for rifled slugs? I also have a Vinci which came with 5 chokes. For the rifled slugs should I use the cylinder or improved cylinder?
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Thanks for the comments, they were helpful
Considering a Benelli M4... or a Fabarm SAT8
in Benelli
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Yes the M4 cycles skeet loads: 1 1/8 oz. will work fine, 1 oz. will fail to cycle occasionally, 7/8 oz. will fail to cycle all the time. But like I said, if you ever want to shoot clays then you will not want to use a M4. If you only want to shoot targets and hunt non flying animals then you will be very happy with the M4. Also the barrel length 18" vs. 24" should make very little difference in accuracy. Longer barrels are better for skeet/trap because they "swing" better, are more stable for aiming at moving, flying targets. If most of your targets are fixed and/or closer than 50 meters then the M4 with its 18" barrel is very accurate, no need for an extension.