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Gun won't fire second round


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Hey all,  just got back from the range and am having a serious problem with the M4.

Last Saturday I had a gunsmith put in my FFT trigger pack. I went to test the trigger when I got it back and found that unless I sent the bolt home from all the way back on the receiver, the trigger wouldn't do anything. The gunsmith assured me that this was normal for an M4 and that you can't half-close the bolt then expect it to fire. I had a feeling he was wrong but I decide to trust him. He also said that he had to shave something (can't remember what) to make it all fit in there. Never bothered to call me to ask permission, which irritated me. 

Today when I went to the range I had a bigger problem. While the gun cycles just fine, it will NOT fire the second round. First round goes bang, ejects, then the second round is loaded. Even though the bolt went all the way back then forward, pulling the trigger gets me a click and I THINK the hammer drops, but there are NO marks on the primer of the shell.

I called Todd at FFT and he said he's never heard of this happening before. Suggested that maybe the guy either removed too much material from whatever he had to shave down, or that maybe the springs were mixed up and put into the wrong spot.

 

Has this happened to anyone else?

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That stinks.  I hope you get it sorted out soon.  Keep us posted.

Did Todd have any reaction to the fact that something needed trimming?

Do you have an OEM trigger housing?  If so is it plastic or the older aluminum?

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He was surprised that the gunsmith would do that, especially without even consulting me first. 

This is all in my OEM trigger housing. Never had this problem with the stock trigger, hammer, disconnecter, so I'm guessing something wasn't installed correctly.

I pulled the trigger group and found that the hammer is getting pushed further down than it should. My guess is that racking the BCG again is enough to jolt it back into position. Just took a video of it and sent to Todd, so we'll see what he says. I contacted the gun shop that installed all of this but they are closed at the moment, so hopefully I'll hear back tomorrow. 

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Sent a video to Todd and he is pretty certain the issue is isolated to the hammer. I need to measure it against the stock hammer to see if it's too thick. If it is, shaving it down a little bit should solve the problem. 

Here are some pictures so that you can see what it's doing:

Where it SHOULD be
m9H4eMRh.jpg

Where it's ending up:
6F9WODwh.jpg

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I think you have an issue someplace around your hammer spring cap. I might be wrong though bc I thought that pushed up on the hammer engaging it where it is supposed to be. Anyway a group swap is easy especially with Stranger here. Look at this tutorial and see if it nudges your either way. 

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, ClackClackBAM said:

Hey all,  just got back from the range and am having a serious problem with the M4.

Last Saturday I had a gunsmith put in my FFT trigger pack. I went to test the trigger when I got it back and found that unless I sent the bolt home from all the way back on the receiver, the trigger wouldn't do anything. The gunsmith assured me that this was normal for an M4 and that you can't half-close the bolt then expect it to fire. I had a feeling he was wrong but I decide to trust him. He also said that he had to shave something (can't remember what) to make it all fit in there. Never bothered to call me to ask permission, which irritated me. 

Today when I went to the range I had a bigger problem. While the gun cycles just fine, it will NOT fire the second round. First round goes bang, ejects, then the second round is loaded. Even though the bolt went all the way back then forward, pulling the trigger gets me a click and I THINK the hammer drops, but there are NO marks on the primer of the shell.

I called Todd at FFT and he said he's never heard of this happening before. Suggested that maybe the guy either removed too much material from whatever he had to shave down, or that maybe the springs were mixed up and put into the wrong spot.

 

Has this happened to anyone else?

@ClackClackBAM  If I was you, I would give the gunsmith the chance to make things right on his end before your start doing any tinkering on your end.  This way all the problems can be associated with the original work done by the gunsmith. People make mistakes...so let this person make good on his end. Now if he ends up leaving you high and dry, give the company some yelp reviews or something of that nature. Based on what you said, that a second round can't be fired, that is 100% not normal. What ammo were you using at the range? 

Edited by MNtadpole
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31 minutes ago, ClackClackBAM said:

Sent a video to Todd and he is pretty certain the issue is isolated to the hammer. I need to measure it against the stock hammer to see if it's too thick. If it is, shaving it down a little bit should solve the problem. 

Here are some pictures so that you can see what it's doing:

Where it SHOULD be
m9H4eMRh.jpg

Where it's ending up:
6F9WODwh.jpg

@ClackClackBAM I would also recommend looking at Stranger Danger's assembly/disassembly instructions and navigate to the conclusion section.  Once there, you should be able to find an operational check sequence of steps. These steps allow you to test all the correct functions of the trigger assembly.  I would be curious to know if, once you check these, if your trigger assembly fails any of them. Let us know once you know! Good luck man.

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Okay, so I think I isolated the problem.

The new hammer is MUCH thicker than the factory version. I swapped the old one back in without changing making any other changes. The hammer will still go lower but now it pops back up on its own. If it doesn't go up by itself, pulling the trigger sends it forward. 

Put everything back in the gun and now I am unable to replicate the original issue. 

While the hammer was out I saw where the gunsmith tried to shave down the housing on both sides. Instead of shaving that down, I'll have a gunsmith make the hammer narrower. 

 

04KET9jh.jpg

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Looks like you’re hung up on the disconnector when the shotgun cycles. I have had to fit a few oem trigger frames where you mentioned before as well. I think we had another user report issues with the polymer trigger frame a few months back. We ended up fixing it by installing an A&S trigger frame. 
 

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26 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:

Looks like you’re hung up on the disconnector when the shotgun cycles. I have had to fit a few oem trigger frames where you mentioned before as well. I think we had another user report issues with the polymer trigger frame a few months back. We ended up fixing it by installing an A&S trigger frame. 
 

Yup. The hammer seems to get pushed down too far then catches on the disconnector. Being too wide for the frame isn't helping either. Simple fix though, I'll just have a gunsmith shave down one side of the hammer so that it matches my OEM's width. The OEM hammer is back in and now the gun works well. I've tried to get it to hang up again but I cannot.

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7 minutes ago, Sigfla said:

Just get an A&S housing and be done with it. That’s what I had to do with mine as the polymer factory one was just too tight. 

When I did my 922(r) assembly, I chose the A&S route too.  Kinda stinks that he might be pushed into that direction...especially since it's another $220.  On the bright side, he does get another +1 in 922(r) compliance with the A&S!

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12 minutes ago, MNtadpole said:

When I did my 922(r) assembly, I chose the A&S route too.  Kinda stinks that he might be pushed into that direction...especially since it's another $220.  On the bright side, he does get another +1 in 922(r) compliance with the A&S!

I'd rather not get the A&S if I don't have to. And I'm all set on 922(r).
There has to be a way to make this fit the OEM housing.

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12 minutes ago, ClackClackBAM said:

I'd rather not get the A&S if I don't have to. And I'm all set on 922(r).
There has to be a way to make this fit the OEM housing.

Fair enough, these platforms are a money pit!

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, ClackClackBAM said:

Simple fix though, I'll just have a gunsmith shave down one side of the hammer so that it matches my OEM's width.

 There goes the NP3 plating.

Edited by Milspec
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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, Milspec said:

 There goes the NP3 plating.

That's my concern too. I would rather shave the OEM housing to accommodate this hammer.

11 minutes ago, Sigfla said:

Send it to Stranger! 

I was just thinking that, actually.

Edited by ClackClackBAM
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2 minutes ago, ClackClackBAM said:

That's my concern too. I really would rather shave the OEM housing to accommodate this hammer.

I was just thinking that, actually.

You could look at buying a Shootersight hammer which is also 922(r), and selling the FFT. I have one in my currently installed trigger assembly. https://shootingsight.com/product/benelli-hammer/ . Just an idea.

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I'd modify the polymer housing before changing the hammer geometry. Your local smith would probably be willing to open it up more for you. I'd gladly do it for the cost of return shipping. If you want the A&S, I'd gladly swap the parts for you for the same deal. The A&S is the ideal route to go to be rid of that polymer crap.

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Are you sure the width of the hammer is the issue? A hammer disconnector hook that is too tall can hold the hammer back like the picture you posted – but you will NOT be able to pull the hammer back up the correct position after cocking the hammer.

If you CAN pull the hammer up into the correct “cocked” position then the “too wide” diagnosis is probably the right one. Coat the hammer with a black or blue Sharpie marker then install it. Functioning the hammer a few cycles will wear the marker color and show you where any contact is occurring.

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