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MikeyZ

EOTech vs. Aimpoint on an M4...OK, let me have it.

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So, as usual, I will use this trusty forum to help me decide on a purchase.

 

EOTechs are popular on an M4. This is obvious to anyone that frequents this place. I know they're large, they sit high, and someone told me they're a little fuzzy when you look through them - although I cannot say, I have never looked. I also know they're holographic sight is out of this world, and the quality of the optic is supposed to be superb. Particularly, the 553 is supposedly the best.

 

Now onto Aimpoint. The Comp M4 is supposed to be amazing. This I have looked at (and through), and it looks great. Looks like a quality piece as well. A different approach here though, of course only having a single dot to acquire your target.

 

So, in terms of CQB use, let me have it. Your thoughts and opinions are appreciated. While we're at it, for completeness, I might as well throw in the Trijicon ACOG Reflex....and any other sighting systems you may have on your mind.

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I would only use an optic for ranges over 50 yards. If you expect your CQBs to be within 35 yards, you might be better off w/o an optic. EOtech recommend a minimum zero in range of 50 yards for all of their HWS models, for example.

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I would only use an optic for ranges over 50 yards. If you expect your CQBs to be within 35 yards, you might be better off w/o an optic. EOtech recommend a minimum zero in range of 50 yards for all of their HWS models, for example.

 

Fair enough point. Allow me to be a bit more general. Let's say within shotgun range.....

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I would only use an optic for ranges over 50 yards. If you expect your CQBs to be within 35 yards, you might be better off w/o an optic. EOtech recommend a minimum zero in range of 50 yards for all of their HWS models, for example.

 

A zero in range does not mean it will not work closer than 50 yards. This couldn't be further from the truth, as the eotech is the finest cqb sight on the market, imo.

 

The zero in range is just the average shot distance you're expected to take with the optic, and an optic zero'd in for 50 yards will be almost dead on at 20 yards, or whatever distance you're talking. In other words, if you sight an optic in for 5 yards, it will be way off at 50, whereas an optic sighted in for 50 will be very close at 5. Sighting in an optic for 50 yards doesn't mean its a 50+ yard optic only, it means it works better if set up that way. Any 1x optic is made for point blank shooting.

 

The only real disadvantage to running an optic is the switching on/off. This takes time and requires batteries, which adds another reliability factor into your firearm.

 

I personally run eotechs on my rifles and iron sights on my m4, because my m4 is set up currently as my primary defense gun. However, I've run an eotech on my m4 many times, and it does the job admirably.

 

It's all personal preference, what the guns intended function is, and how much time you think you will have if the gun is being used for home defense.

 

It's late, hope I made sense.

 

edit: as far as choosing between an aimpoint and an eotech, I think the eotech is hands down better for a shotgun. It has faster target acquisition, the reticle is made for cqb and it just plain works better than an aimpoint on a shotgun. I own both and have tried both, I like them both for separate functions. I prefer the eotech on a shotgun, if I'm running an optic.

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http://img254.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc03183ws2cu0.jpg

 

I pretty sure no model of aimpoint (definately not the eotechs) will cowitness with the ghost rings. I do not know if a Docter will or not (pics anybody?)..?

 

The 2 real key factors for me are comfortable cheek weld and quick release mounting. By quick release I don't mean that you need a throw-lever, but at least a thumbscrew. You don't want to be ducking behind cover fumbling with an allen-wrench just so you can access you buis. I have an eotech on mine (yes, still) and do not like it one bit. Even with a blackhawk cheek pad, the cheek weld is horrible and I feel sloppy when shooting it. I much prefer the ghost rings. I plan on switching to a Docter or aimpoint mini if I ever get around to it, either way whatever I put on there is gonna have a thumbscrew.

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Well, the fact is that either one can be used turned off. When used on a shotgun, and if the target is within 15 feet, the optic can be used like an old fashioned camera window. Simply put, if you can see it through the lense, it can be hit. "Smile, you're on Candid Camera".

 

I have both optics too, and I think they are both good. Having said that, I do think that EoTech does offer some advantages when it comes to quick target aquisition, but I personally prefer the Aimpoint Comp M4 (or any other Aimpoint), because I like having the option of using a ***2 NV attachment in front of the optic, and EoTechs are not compatible with the ***2.

 

I know that there are other NV attachments that you can use an EoTech with, but I personally like the ***2 as it can be used with other scopes that I have, and I would rather not spend a whole bunch of money on several different NV devices.

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you girlfriends should find a room,,those lengthly intimate replies ya'll give eachother are almost pornographic.---------------------------------------PS:my money goes for Burris Optics

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you girlfriends should find a room,,those lengthly intimate replies ya'll give eachother are almost pornographic.---------------------------------------PS:my money goes for Burris Optics

 

Translation: ",,,,,,hey guys stop using big words,,,,,,,come look at my 20,,,, year old guns y'all,,,,"

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I have the Burris Fastfire on mine. It works great. Made of all metal. Not plastic or a composite like a couple of the others out there. Plus it won't kill your pocket book. I paid right at $200 for mine.

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",,,,,,hey guys stop using big words,,,,,,,come look at my 20,,,, year old guns y'all,,,,"

 

Now THAT'S pornographic! :D

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my M4 has a Docter sight mounted on it. Light weight, no turn on or off (just flip the cap if it's covered), less likely to get banged!

 

my .02

 

thanks,

Deldorado

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The Burris looks pretty good. Have to look into that further, as I know nothing about them.

 

Deldorado - How is that Docter in low vs. high light environments (since there is no adjusting the brightness of the dot)? Is the front post viewable through the optic? Lastly, how long is the tritium in that baby supposed to last? Thanks for your input.

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Translation: ",,,,,,hey guys stop using big words,,,,,,,come look at my 20,,,, year old guns y'all,,,,"
its a twenty five year old Benelli to you sonny

,,vintage 1983,,probably when you where born

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Mikey

 

Aimpoint is the way to go -- i just posted my rig's options in another thread. For CQB work placing that simple red dot on your adversary is quick; the optic is bombproof (I've seen the T-1 thrown on the ground, replaced on the weapon, and maintain its zero); and customer service is solid.

 

Just my opinion.....

 

KJO

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its a twenty five year old Benelli to you sonny

,,vintage 1983,,probably when you where born

 

2 years before :)

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The one thing I like about the EOTECH is that it gives you that nice 65 MOI large circle. Rough indication of 'blast radius"! I think the aimpoints only give a dot, which is why I prefer EOTECHs.

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Guys, just my personal opinion, but you don't really need optics on your shotgun. They will slow you down (on a shotgun) On an M4 you've already got the excellent ghost rings for stationary targets. For moving targets you definitely don't want optics. Take your M4 to a skeet or trap range and try and hit a moving clay with an EOTech, LOL.

As far as red dots, if you must, the Burris Fastfire is real hard to beat and weighs less than a couple ounces. It can take a beating, like 500g. I shoot them all the time on my UZI's. As good as a Doctor Optic, for less than half the price. The only drawback is you can get the Doctor with the 7moa dot vs. the 4moa dot on the Fastfire. I like the EOtech's, but I just don't think they're right on a shotgun. Plenty of folks will probably disagree. YMMV.

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I would only use an optic for ranges over 50 yards. If you expect your CQBs to be within 35 yards, you might be better off w/o an optic. EOtech recommend a minimum zero in range of 50 yards for all of their HWS models, for example.

 

They recommend a 50 yard 0 because that is where the .223 is best 0 at. IF you are 0'd at 50 you are also 0'd at 225. Optics also give you an edge in CQB no need to wait to 50 yards. Optics are always a plus and do not slow you down.

Pat

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So, as usual, I will use this trusty forum to help me decide on a purchase.

 

EOTechs are popular on an M4. This is obvious to anyone that frequents this place. I know they're large, they sit high, and someone told me they're a little fuzzy when you look through them - although I cannot say, I have never looked. I also know they're holographic sight is out of this world, and the quality of the optic is supposed to be superb. Particularly, the 553 is supposedly the best.

 

Now onto Aimpoint. The Comp M4 is supposed to be amazing. This I have looked at (and through), and it looks great. Looks like a quality piece as well. A different approach here though, of course only having a single dot to acquire your target.

 

So, in terms of CQB use, let me have it. Your thoughts and opinions are appreciated. While we're at it, for completeness, I might as well throw in the Trijicon ACOG Reflex....and any other sighting systems you may have on your mind.

 

I have both the Aimpoint and the Eotech and hands down I would use the Eotech. They lend themselves to shotguns really well also because they have the 65 moa ring as well as the 1. To sum my opinion up, the Aimpoint is old technology and the Eotech is new technology.

 

Once you take your shotty to the range with your Eotech on it you will be floored how quickly you can get on target, in any light condition, with both eyes open. They are simply amazing in CQB.

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The Burris looks pretty good. Have to look into that further, as I know nothing about them.

 

Deldorado - How is that Docter in low vs. high light environments (since there is no adjusting the brightness of the dot)? Is the front post viewable through the optic? Lastly, how long is the tritium in that baby supposed to last? Thanks for your input.

 

The Burris and the Docter both have auto brightness, a nice touch. I hunt and have aimpoint, eotech and burris, the auto brightness takes away the adjusting as daylight changes. The eotech is the hardest to see in bright light.

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For those of you that are considering an LaRue QDM for either the Eotech or Aimpoint, be aware that the design of the LaRue mount will fail on Weaver rails (which the Benilli's have). They will fly forward off the forward end of the rail! That is because the forward stop does not go completely across the bottom of the LaRue mount and the 'sharp' edges of the Weaver rails will remove the soft aluminum on the LaRue's forward locking bar. Ask me how I found out :(

 

Not knocking LaRue products, I have many others and they are wonderful on Picitiny rails. They will work fine if you mount your accessories on a Picitiny rail system.

 

The GG&G Accucam works great on our Benelli's Weaver rail.

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Well that is good info, what would you suggest for someone contemplating running a LaRue Tactical IronDot FastFire COMFFLT627 ?

Anyone running this setup?

 

Does it co-witness?

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They recommend a 50 yard 0 because that is where the .223 is best 0 at. IF you are 0'd at 50 you are also 0'd at 225. Optics also give you an edge in CQB no need to wait to 50 yards. Optics are always a plus and do not slow you down.

Pat

 

No optics are not always a plus. On a shotgun they are not a plus FOR ALL APPLICATIONS. On a Rifle/Carbine or a Subgun, I totally agree. On a shotgun, I can shoot against myself both with an optic and without. I will be faster and put more lead on target without an optic. Again, go shoot skeet with an optic and see how good you do and how fast you are.

Some would say that skeet is not a good indicator of whether or not an optic is effective on a shotgun. Your shooting at fast moving targets at relatively close range. If you can do this well, then shooting a moving adversary should be relatively easy. This is taking into account the fear factor, which your gonna have either with or without an optic.

People that try and shoot a shotgun like a carbine are going to get killed if they run up against an expert shotgunner (unless they just get lucky). It's a free country though, so you certainly have a right to your opinion and I respect that.

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MY agency has Eotech 552 sights on several of our Bushmaster M-4's. We have has issues with the battery compartments breaking. Eotech has been very good about sending replacements. On my Personal AR I have been using an Aimpoint Comp ML3 and like it alot.

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I love Eotech's on a carbine. I also like the Micro Aimpoint, but for me, the Eotech is a faster aquisition sight because of the 65 moa ring.

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