kenw111
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Posts
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Posts posted by kenw111
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Yes, it sure it pretty, looks like one of those guns that gets dressed up and never shot. Youre one of "those" .
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13 minutes ago, Scout_21 said:
False, red dots use LEDs not lasers...
most lasers ARE LEDs son..... both are point-source light emissions.
glad i could fix that confusion for you
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7 minutes ago, Scout_21 said:
Red dots use LEDs not lasers...
some are (the junk ones), not all.
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17 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
???
Who is talking about birdshot? You should know your buckshot load pattern at various ranges.
None of the other options presented here can even see the iron sights. They’re obstructed by the optic housing. Maybe some have a wait-a-minute quick detach lever on their base.
name me one TINY red dot HWS that has a quick detach throw lever.
maybe one exists, but not that i know of .
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40 minutes ago, Scout_21 said:
Red dots are not holographic weapon sights (HWS). Two different technologies at play.
not really, theyre both laser or laser from beam-splitter projections on semi-mirrored glass
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5 minutes ago, Evolution said:
As long as you think that you know what you're speaking about, you might as well learn the difference between SHEER and SHEAR.
The word that you're using to describe the SHEARING FORCE on the pic rail has no application for what you are talking about. SHEER and SHEER-ING is not even a word in this context.
Unless you're talking about ladie's stockings.
Yes yes, my typo. ... indeed
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48 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
Or the 100+ Benelli M4's that have come thru my shop for work in various configurations. So why argue?
Please report back:
1. how many of those people unintelligently mounted an Eotech or larger on their Benelli
2. Of those that DID,...... how many rounds down the barrel
otherwise its called a hearsay fallacy.
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2 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
Even if the sight was dead, you could use the window as a large ghost ring that would be good enough for shotgunning distances.
a dead window vs. the rear sights....... rear sights win.
However your premise is accurate , .....generally. NOT generally however for slugs and 00 buck,......these are not bird guns throwing a swath of tiny pellets.
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37 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
You wouldn't change your position no matter what amount of evidence was given, so why bother? Telling you about the M4s' with 10,000 rounds of high base through them with EOTech 552's would be a waste of time. Or the 100+ Benelli M4's that have come thru my shop for work in various configurations. So why argue?
You can do as you like.
you:
1. NO EVIDENCE
2. your own anecdotal account.
me:
1. one example posted above...yet another one below... ( i can post 2 more if you wish)
2. laws of Newton / Physics
3. Seen it happen twice myself.
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20 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
If you don't like the obstructions from the rear sight, why not remove the entire rear sight assembly? You'll cut about 3 ounces of weight. You could also remove the front sight hood to unclutter the sight picture.
logical and reasonable, yes. nods head
Contra-indicative use premise being however that all battery operated sights under adverse conditions take a dump on themselves given a chance, .....and redundancy is god.
i.e. backup iron sights.
hugs and kisses
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11 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
Is that what passes for an intelligent rebuttal here in the "Land of OZ"?
tell it to this guy (below) that mounted a large-mass (same as an Eotech) Aimpoint on his M4
sheered off
Im a gunsmith and seen it happen twice on Benellis. So, Marsha,.... facts are facts. The laws of Newton / Physics STILL APPLY
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10 minutes ago, StrangerDanger said:
Lets see if I can dispel some myths here. The top rail is plenty strong to mount whatever optic you want. I've used EOTech 552's in the past on the M4 without any mounting issues
ROFL......... there are no MOUNTING ISSUES.... that goes without saying, the ISSUE is keeping an Eotech (or something even larger) MOUNTED over xxxx# 1000s of shots fired.
1. the M4 / M2 receiver is ALUMINUM
2. Mass / inertia SHEERING FORCED imparted by good old Newtonian LAW will SHEER the screws, and if the screws manage to NOT SHEER, the threads will STRIP,........PERIOD
and NONE OF THIS has a single darn thing to do with loctite and or proper torque applied to those screws.
You said "Lets see if I can dispel some myths here"
the only MYTH on this thread are the countless people that think laws of Newton / Physics DONT APPLY to a HUGE MASS sitting on a rail screwed into an ALUMINUM RECEIVER
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17 hours ago, bodybuilder said:
And what's wrong with an Eotech on a Benelli???
its called a SHEERING MASS.
Benelli will flat out tell you not to mount an absurd mass like that on top of a Benelli.
Are you a gunsmith? I am.
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2 hours ago, Evolution said:
LOL...more like a donkey codpiece...
thats good, lets see your leatherworking skills.
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2 hours ago, Jolly Roger said:
Were you born an asshole or do you practice and work hard at being one?
ad hominem and not on topic.
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1 hour ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
Interestingly the poster in that thread failed to mention which model Aimpoint "flew off." Was it a Micro, M4Comp, PRO, M3Comp, etc.?
I'm thinking that just to be safe NO ONE should mount ANY optic to the Benelli rail. /s
And thank you for reinforcing my notion that some people are never wrong.
Whoooooops, heres yet ANOTHER guy who thought it a hot idea to mount a nasty big MASS to his M4 Benelli, ...the rail FLEW OFF
this time was a side-saddle attached to the top PIC RAIL and its screws.
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56 minutes ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
It's noteworthy that you never included any warning about increasing magazine capacity without 922(r) compliance.
It's genuinely asinine to suggest to someone that they increase their magazine capacity with a made in Italy component which costs $50 more than a full length Made in the USA magazine tube that doesn't make the M4 look cobbled together while throwing off the 922(r) compliant components count (i.e. causing one to figure out which other Made in the USA components one should install). Some of us want to keep the aftermarket parts count as low as possible, e.g. Made in the USA full length magazine tube, a magazine follower (that's the easy one besides the mag tube), and possibly the handguards or buttstock (if one doesn't want to mess with the fire control). Keep it simple.
Any conversation about increasing magazine capacity goes hand in hand with 922(r) compliance whether one agrees with it or not.
Spending an additional $50 plus adding to the Made in USA parts count requirement - JPS syndrome.
its noteworthy HOW FAST i proved you wrong in that other thread about mass on top of the pic rail,.... its even EASIER to do so here.
1. its the responsibility of the owner before modding the gun / shotgun to LEARN 922R compliance regulations and the PARTS LIST and NUMBER OF PARTS needed to make it 922r
2. putting on a Italy genuine +2 DOES NOT KEEP ANYONE FROM MAKING THE M4 922r COMPLIANT with the appropriate parts and number of same.
3. Keep it simple?????? there is NOTHING MORE SIMPLE that adding a +2 and then a USA made follower, stock set, hammer, disconnector, trigger etc......
thats FAR easier than using a heat gun to remove the 5 round BASE TUBE
and it makes the gun 10000X easier to clean the shell tube / replace springs.
Some people (for the reasons just listed) do NOT want a FULL TUBE,............NOR does doing this make it "harder" to make said gun 922r compliant.
Please dont waste my time, or the OP time posting illogical hyperbole and inaccurate subjective opinions.
922r compliance parts list / possibles, easiest highlighted in black.
- Receiver
- Barrel
- Bolt
- Bolt carrier
- Gas piston
- Trigger housing
- Trigger
- Hammer
- Disconnector
- Buttstock (with integral pistol grip)
- Forearm/handguard (forend)
- Magazine body
- Follower
Notice that the “magazine body” is in the list. This is the magazine tube. So, if you install a full length magazine tube on your gun, you are replacing the factory magazine tube, so you now only need to install two more parts off the list to be in full compliance with 922(r).
Notice that the three parts must be USA made and totally replaced. Therefore, the installation of a magazine EXTENSION does not count towards 922(r) compliance. To use the EXTENSION, the user must still replace a total of three other parts off that list in order to be compliant with federal law. The reason the EXTENSION tube does not count towards compliance is because you mustreplace the original part with the USA made part, and using the EXTENSION does not replace the original magazine tube, it only extends it.
The ATF specifically stated in the letter we received that “no paperwork or fees are required to alter your weapon as long as the barrel length is kept above 18 inches, the weapon features a shoulder stock, and the resulting firearm retains an overall length of at least 26 inches (with stock extended).” Additionally, ATF agents we have spoken to at the SHOT Show have informed us that it is not necessary that the parts are stamped with marks identifying the part as made in the USA, but it is a nice precaution that any parts one uses to achieve compliance are indeed marked as made in the United States.
It should be noted that this discussion in general presumes you are either using the Benelli OEM stock or an aftermarket stock, and NOT the Benelli M4 collapsible stock. For those using the Benelli brand collapsible stock, you actually increase the 922(r) part count by one, meaning you would need to replace a total of four (4) other parts to achieve compliance. This is because the original Benelli M4 stock is a stock with an integrated pistol grip. The Benelli collapsible stock is two pieces comprised of the stock as one piece and the pistol grip as another piece.
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2 minutes ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
While there are no *known* (at least that I know of) prosecutions for 922(r) violations, disregard the 922(r) regs at your own peril.
Also, no one should be advocating doing anything illegal on this forum regardless of one's opinion on the statute(s).
adding a +2 does not IMPLY or SAY one should violate 922r
I never SAID, NOR IMPLIED any such nonsense.
youve created a STRAWMAN FALLACY assuming anyone here was saying or advocating a 922r violation.
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1 minute ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
Interestingly the poster in that thread failed to mention which model Aimpoint "flew off." Was it a Micro, M4Comp, PRO, M3Comp, etc.?
I'm thinking that just to be safe NO ONE should mount ANY optic to the Benelli rail. /s
And thank you for reinforcing my notion that some people are never wrong.
Ahem,...Im a conceal carry instructor, i own my own shooting range, worked in 3 gun shops, 2 as a gunsmith.
let me lay down some PHYSICS
1. gun recoils backwards
2. giant MASS / WEIGHT optic (the wrong kind of huuuuge optics<<<) sits on top and RESISTS MOVEMENT
3. xxxx 1000s (very few) of shots fired and the rail SHEERS OFF /FALLS OFF cause either 1. the screws SHEER OFF.......2. the THREADS GET STRIPPED and the rail FALLS off.
Benelli will flat out tell you to never mount Elephantine optics on any of their shotguns. But if people wanna learn the hard way, mmmmkay.
Ive seen it happen twice, once was Eotech, the other an offbrand junk-box of equal size (i forget the chinese mfg.)
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16 minutes ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
Got any examples of a Benelli M4 aluminum receiver failing where the rail is mounted?
Photos or it didn't happen.
Funny how no one on this strictly Benelli oriented forum has ever reported such a thing happening to a Benelli shotgun.
You said above : "Funny how no one on this strictly Benelli oriented forum has ever reported"
ohh snap, you spoke too soon, ...... seems your 100% WRONG
took me 5 seconds to find an example ON THIS FORUM!!!!!!!!
let me quote from the below::::
My Picatinny rail flew off the gun during shooting (I had an Aimpoint on the rail)! Worse, several of the receiver screw holes are stripped.
The rangemaster (who is also a gun smith) said this is not at all surprising considering the recoil of the shotgun. He sees it fairly often.
huge mass aimpoint he had on it !
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10 minutes ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
Funny how no one on this strictly Benelli oriented forum has ever reported such a thing happening to a Benelli shotgun.
thats because 99.999999999% of everyone on this forum is too intelligent to mount an elephant sized and weighted optic on top of a Benelli.
Nobody on earth has a video / picture of a bear dying of old age in the forest either......but such absurd logic, that never happens either!
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This is about TACTICAL USE / BUILD of a Benelli………NOT skeet, not birds from a blind! etc
Typical accurate but 100% IGNORANT statement :::
“Again, go shoot skeet with an optic and see how good you do and how fast you are.”.
TRUE, but skeet / birds is NOT a tactical setup for a Benelli M2 / M4 !!
99% of which is SLUGS and 00 BUCK for CQB use……Iron sights are wonderful for countless reasons, but a holographic display is best in most instances for accuracy in use of CQB, Eotech is the best holographic display, but an insanely ignorant, obnoxious horrific idea to put on a ANY BENELLI , ever. ….. I love EOTECHs and own 7 of them, but NONE OF THEM are mounted on any of my Benellis for what should be a totally obvious set of reasons
>>>>>Option #1 below:
Eotech are the best HWS (holographic weapons sight) but they’re HUGE and not for shotgun use, ever PERIOD… (I own 7 of them! I love eotechs)….They are the WORST IDEA imaginable to mount on any Benelli, the mass of same will SHEER the screws (seen it happen 2 times to others) holding the pic rail to the frame, also too, it will splay / enlarge the threaded screw holes on the frame……not only is this absurd, its like a elephant riding on a horse……Its both sketch and cringe worthy to see one mounted on a Benelli….. I love the heck out of EOTECHs!,…..but that is NEVER going on a Benelli for countless reasons! Ughhhh!.
>>>>Option #2 below: (now we are talking!!!!)
Either Vortex Razor Red dot (what I use on my Benellis) or the Trijicon are the ACTUAL HWS (holographic weapons sight) that should be used on a Benelli!!
Incredible FOV for CQB or dropping a slug ACCURATELY on a subject at 50+ yards (if needed). ……….Option #2 (most logical in my conclusion , see option #3 below) does NOT co-witness with the iron sights and that is 100% exactly what I want, I do not want the busy &$%((^(#!!! Mess of iron sights in the window of my HWS (holographic weapons sight) !!.
https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-razor-red-dot.html?vortex_reticle=942
>>>>Option #3 below:
Sleek, low profile, the “sexy” option…..a Trijicon on the sclarworks……PROBLEM???? See picture below…..i tried this setup on a buddies gun and its HORRIFIC, I hated it, I do NOT NOT NOT want iron sights sticking its ‘butt’ in my face occluding my HWS (holographic weapons sight) WINDOW!! Of course this is subjective, but I hate to Hades and back of having my HWS (holographic weapons sight) occluded by anything, …….i laugh every time someone praises the co-witnessing of iron sights with optics…….Ughhhh!
https://scalarworks.com/shop/optic-mounts/sync-trijicon-rmr-mount/
>>>>Option #4 below:
Or something like this where an Elephant is riding on the back of a pony ……. (rolls eyes)…… Seen several Benellis have something like this
The Benelli frame is ALUMINUM, the shock and sheer force from such a mass will , given time, SHEER the bolts from the frame, but will with 100% certainly splay / enlarge the holes on the frame….. this is NOT a STEEL FRAMED Remington 870 !!
Top heavy disaster / mess,…….. you just do NOT put optics like this on a Benelli, …….. EVERRRRRRRRRRRRR.
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4 hours ago, Skull and Bones said:
Thanks! Any tips or tricks as far as install? Same spring, follower, ?
get the stainless daves metal works springs for a full tube, but you CAN use the same spring, many people do.
youll need to move the split ring CAP at the end of the factor 5 round tube to the END of the +2 tube, but thats easy as hell.
screw it all together, dont forget to grease the threads.
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4 hours ago, Sukhoi_fan said:
If you put that made in Italy Benelli magazine extension on your M4 you will need at least three 'Made in the USA' parts added otherwise you'll be in violation of 922(r) (if you have a C stock instead of a fixed stock you will need a total of four 'Made in the USA' parts) - i.e. unless you're not the least bit concerned about 922(r) compliance.
FYI, that Benelli magazine extension is steel, just like the OEM magazine tube and Dave's Metal Works full length magazine tube so you'd be spending an additional $50 just to have the Benelli name (which is nowhere to be seen on the extension itself) AND it will appear pieced together rather than the way a M4 should look. Why pay an additional $50 for that?? A M4 looks so much better with a full length mag tube instead of a pieced together mag tube.
not true.... by adding a +2 tube its super easy to clean the tube (most peeps are lazy as hell and never do it), and change the spring (which you should do regularly).
a FULL TUBE you have to remove the damned split ring cap to un-spring it and clean the tube. a +2 is far more handy for breaking the gun down.....its ALL factory, and it does NOT look "pieced together" by having a +2 tube
Good sight for benelli M4?
in Benelli
Posted
Get the RAZOR VORTEX, all these "must look pretty gun" types above (most of which dont even shoot much) love the LOW PROFILE of the RMR and flat rail, but the RMR sucks backside in incident lighting, is overpriced, and overtly fragile.