MassMark Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Today being just a stellar autumn day here in the mountains of Western Massachusetts, I decided it was time to do some informal testing of a relatively new home defense round marketed by Remington. Noted on the box as: "Wingmaster HD Ultimate Home Defense", how could I not give it a try? To run this test, I measured out a room space of about 15-feet. Sadly, that put me into a muck-pile, so I measured to 20-feet for the purposes of this test. When I got home, I measured the distance from my bedroom door, to the entrance to my living room and low and behold: 19-feet 9-inches, so my 20-foot measurement was not too far off - at least for me... First, these puppies are not cheap. At over $2.00 a whack, they are anything but easy on the wallet. Secondly, the "Wingmaster HD", just makes me feel like these are nothing more than 2 3/4 high-brass BB goose loads, but what do I know? Remington claims that the HD rounds will hold a tight pattern at most commonly encountered home defense distances and rate the load of tungsten BB shot at 1200fps. They do not however list energy at impact. The shells themselves are very smooth to fire - they feel almost "low recoil", though they are not marketed this way. This due in large part to the Benelli Super Nova Tactical I just acquired being likely the lightest recoiling pump gun I've ever fired out of the box. At exactly 20-feet, I took at shot with the Remington HD on one target and standard Remington 00-Buck on the other. The results are shown below: The spread at 20-feet is troubling to me. I am no impact physics engineer, nor am I an ammunition expert. The rounds just felt "soft" to me and the pattern, though I'm sure would be troubling - perhaps lethally so to a would-be intruder, I was left wondering if these rounds were really "Ultimate HD"? The pellets impacted the berm behind the target board, (spongy pressboard), with a smattering of dust kicked up at impact. the Remington Buckmaster however, tore through the target and slammed into the berm with authority - temporarily obscuring the target in a cloud of dust. I would love to give these a try in a more controlled environment with some ballistic gel and some clothing fabric. The "Ultimate HD", just didn't feel...well...ultimate. They tag line these rounds with: "Don't Trust Your Families Safety to Anything Else"... I think I'll stick with good old 00 for now thanks anyway - I have been trusting my families safety with 00-buck for years, but am always open to new ideas and I am an ammo pig, so will likely try other fodder... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 The new remington HD load is one of the best out there for rabbits and the like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassMark Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 The new remington HD load is one of the best out there for rabbits and the like. LOL - that they are, but we're not talking bunnies now are we? Just for fun, I took the liberty of sending some Brenneke KO's down range and was absolutely impressed. Talk about an accurate and hard-hitting rifled slug. Brenneke markets them as sabots for both smooth and rifled barrels, though their definition of a sabot in this case is more like a "pusher" rather than a dedicated separating sabot found in rifled-only rounds. Sabot means "shoe", so this is more like a sandal... For this test, I went back to the firing line and shot the below group at 50-yards. Accuracy was quite good - really good if you ask me. Recoil was crisp, but exceptionally manageable out of the Super Nova tactical. This has not been my experience firing these out of a Remington 870, which highlights the Benelli's superb recoil management - even without the ComforTech stock. They absolutely slammed the 50-yard berm - obliterating it in a cloud of dust. The stats are a 1oz hunk of slug cruising at just under 1510fps - ouchie. Though I found the pushers behind the target board, the slugs were buried deep within the berm - these pups pack a wallop... The last thing I did was just for kicks. I cranked off the four remaining rounds of Buckmaster as fast as I could cycle it - again at 50-yards. Not too shabby for a guy just cranking off some 00-buck in the autumn sunshine. The Super Nova tactical is everything I thought it would be, (and then some). I am looking forward to buying Cody's OEM +2 and ordering a Mesa Tactical saddle/rail for this most excellent defensive tool...The Remington Ultimate HD left me unimpressed, though perhaps further testing lies ahead - I still have 8-rounds left anyway.... More Info Here: http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/shotshell/home_defense/ And Here: http://www.brennekeusa.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 I expected more from Brenneke. That is about 150% larger than the groups I get offhand at 50-60 yards from my M4 using Winchester or Remington. I guess the brenneke performs better on target though. As to "not talking bunnies" what the **** else are you going to shirt with birdshot, or do you hunt geese? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassMark Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 (edited) Uhhh...Yeah, well that was the point of the test. Remington markets these shells as "Ultimate Home Defense" - not goose or rabbit loads... I didn't buy it when I bought them and buy it even less now that I've shot them. Not everyone - especially a new shooter may be as skeptical as you and I. As to Brenneke - don't be so sure it was the slugs and not the shooter. I was having fun. The first of the Brenneke slugs hit center, (#1 in the red, #2 immediately to it's left). I was having fun - the last three were a result of me grinning.... I'm sure you're a whiz-bang with your M4, but (A), I was doing an informal test in the sunshine and (B), the targets are not full-size silhouettes - their size is representative of center mass - this ain't Camp Perry... If you'd like to swing by for more formal testing, I'm game.... Edited October 27, 2009 by MassMark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Uhhh...Yeah, well that was the point of the test. Remington markets these shells as "Ultimate Home Defense" - not goose or rabbit loads... I didn't buy it when I bought them and buy it even less now that I've shot them. Not everyone - especially a new shooter may not be as skeptical as you and I. As to Brenneke - don't be so sure it was the slugs and not the shooter. I was having fun. The first of the Brenneke slugs hit center, (#1 in the red, #2 immediately to it's left). I was having fun - the last three were a result of me grinning.... I'm sure you're a whiz-bang with your M4, but (A), I was doing an informal test in the sunshine and (B), the targets are not full-size silhouettes - their size is representative of center mass - this ain't Camp Perry... If you'd like to swing by for more formal testing, I'm game.... Meh, I prefer buckshot. Here is 1-shot at 50 yards (4 of 8 pellets hit the target as noted). Yeah, most of my stuff is just backyard shooting car-doors, etc. I love me some informal "lets shoot cool stuff" fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassMark Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 Good stuff! I'm not sure where you are, but if you ever find yourself wandering in Western Massachusetts, drop me a PM. Another forum I belong to has members shoots. We do car shoots and are having a tannerite pumpkin shoot in November...You'd have a blast...(pardon the pun).... I was a hairs breath from an M4...We get ProDeals from Benelli. The price is nail biting low...I'm due another one in 2010, so I'm saving now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyson129 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Good stuff! I'm not sure where you are, but if you ever find yourself wandering in Western Massachusetts, drop me a PM. Another forum I belong to has members shoots. We do car shoots and are having a tannerite pumpkin shoot in November...You'd have a blast...(pardon the pun).... I was a hairs breath from an M4...We get ProDeals from Benelli. The price is nail biting low...I'm due another one in 2010, so I'm saving now. I use tannerite for blowing up fridges and ovens to smitherines when people illegally dump in our gravel pits (Stand @ least 150 yards back because shrapnel will still land all around you...200 yards back recommended!). Also I have been known to empty some small ponds with a few pounds of it in a container that we throw out into the middle (No not ponds you fish on). Good luck with that stuff but be careful...I don't even think I should be talking about it on here. Be safe and have fun. But for sure be safe!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyson129 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 I will have to dig up some of that video I have of tannerite....so that all of you can think twice before using any if you can even get it. I got one video with the water emptying a small pond and filling back up...If I can find it you guys will be in for a real treat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassMark Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 I will have to dig up some of that video I have of tannerite....so that all of you can think twice before using any if you can even get it. I got one video with the water emptying a small pond and filling back up...If I can find it you guys will be in for a real treat! Yeah, we had a shoot a few weeks ago and it was a blast, (pun intended). It was a pretty controlled environment - rifle range at the 100-yard berm. Tannerite is perfectly legal in most states, (but it's a question here behind enemy lines). We had our shoot in New Hampshire - a free state. The small jars are anti-climactic - neat, but I think pumpkins filled with it will be quite fun... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyson129 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Yeah, we had a shoot a few weeks ago and it was a blast, (pun intended). It was a pretty controlled environment - rifle range at the 100-yard berm. Tannerite is perfectly legal in most states, (but it's a question here behind enemy lines). We had our shoot in New Hampshire - a free state. The small jars are anti-climactic - neat, but I think pumpkins filled with it will be quite fun... Yeah, but with most explosives I don't feel comfortable introducing people to them, because one stupid sheet on here sees it and does something dumb, it can ban it for the rest of us who have a lot of fun with it. I would love for you to post some footage of those pumpkins going KaBooM!! With that at least you don't have to worry about deadly debris! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyson129 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 (edited) Sorry it took a while to find the footage. Here it is, hope you all are really careful when using this stuff! Hope you enjoy, sorry about the shaky camera and the water video where the camera is turned...Water went too high and I tried to get the whole thing on film....Didn't work so hot..... Watch the upper left hand corner to middle of the screen at the end... http://s584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/tyson129/?action=view¤t=Dryer_T1.flv Debris got a little close for comfort... http://s584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/tyson129/?action=view¤t=Oven_T1.flv Water Fun... http://s584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/tyson129/?action=view¤t=Water_Pit.flv Happy Hunting and Shooting! Edited November 23, 2009 by tyson129 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyson129 Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Do you guys like what you see? Probably would have got responses if it was done with a shotgun, but you need a bullet traveling at extremely high velocity to get the explosion...Or at least a good one, not to mention be out of range of shrapnel! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioM4 Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 I thought the videos were cool. I think you should have started a new thread titled Tannerite if you want more responses. Maybe "Remington Ultimate HD" is just too boring to bother looking at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 I thought the videos were cool. I think you should have started a new thread titled Tannerite if you want more responses. Maybe "Remington Ultimate HD" is just too boring to bother looking at. Boring? No, just makes people think of the weak ass turkey load they are passing off as meant for people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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