Canazes9

Took my son to the lease this weekend, he still didn't get the shot at the buck he was hoping for. Last evening hunt I decided I would break out the foxpro and try and shoot a coyote as we have really been seeing a bunch lately. I had a specific location that I wanted to try, but I wanted to wait till later in the evening so I set up 3 different stands in 3 places on the property w/ no luck. Finally right at sun down I set up in the area where I had been seeing a lot of them. As I'm walking in I see a coyote about 100 yards across the meadow I wanted to hunt. The coyote was upwind of me, but busted me on movement and scampered out of there. I had wanted to set up pretty much in the exact spot where the coyote was so I would have 100 yards (or so) of downrange field to shoot. I decided to set up quickly and only go midway across the field, in case I could lure that coyote back. I put my foxpro in a small mesquite about 3' off the ground and put the new mojo critter in the dirt about 3' away. Walked downwind and crosswind about 70 yards and hit the cotton tail distress. Within 30 seconds the coyote that I had seen earlier was back looking directly at me, the mojo critter was half way between us and was cycled off. The mojo cycled on it's spin cycle and the coyote lurched violently sideways and locked in on it w/ it's eyes. The mojo cycled off - the 'yote is standing still as a statue, eyes fixed slightly quivering, like a lab that's waiting for you to release it to go fetch. I hadn't shot to this point because the coyote is looking directly at me, about 70 yards behind the mojo downwind and crosswind. I knew there was no way this coyote was going to come in straight downwind to the mojo, it would circle around and when it did it would not be looking at me anymore and I would have an opportunity to get my rifle up without being seen. The mojo cycled on again and the coyote burst into a full speed sprint right at it (and me!). It ran directly downwind, no sign of letting up - I realized that mojo was about to get hammered! Couldn't wait any longer, I threw my rifle up, swept the safety off in one motion. The coyote never noticed, despite looking directly at me - it's attention was squarely focused on the mojo. I began to squeeze the trigger trying to time that odd lumpy coyote run. Crosshairs dead center in the jumping chest, the gun goes off and I hit her a little low. She breaks her sprint spins twice and disappears into some heavy brush to my right. My heart and head is racing so fast I didn't even try to get off another shot , just watched her run (way to go stupid...). I'm still trying to process all of this in my head, and my cell phone vibrates in my pocket. A buddy hunting w/ his 10 yr old sends me a text, got a spike down, needs help. Text back "on my way..." I silence the foxpro and stand up to walk over to where I hit the coyote to check for blood and to my right about 50 yards away I hear a warning bark. I look just in time to see two coyotes running full bore for the next county - dang, hate to educate 'yotes like that! Probably could have had a shot on them too if I had let the caller run for another 2 minutes.... Walk over to where I shot the coyote and there is a long ribbon of bright blood followed by thick splatters into the brush - solid evidence of a good lung shot. I don't have time to track this coyote w/ my buddy waiting on me (his son's first deer). W/ a solid hit like that it shouldn't have gone far. I tried following the path that I thought it should have taken but can't find it. I broke off and helped my buddy recover & clean his son's first deer. This morning after the last hunt for this trip, I went back to where the coyote had been shot. It takes me about 15 minutes to find her in the heavy brush, once again, my eyes lied to me about where the animal ran - blood trail takes me in a different direction and I found her about 60 yards from where she was shot. David

Last of the AI stock pics:

More of the AI stock:

Also, for those that want wood but also want a full aluminum bedding block there are options: http://www.accurateinnovations.com/ I have one of these for my Remington model 7 in 7mm-08, and am very pleased with it, though I must admit I try not to subject it to the same abuse the Ruger gets.... David

I choose wood for my rifles because I prefer the feel and don't see any performance gains with synthetic. I prefer the way a wood stock feels in my hands when I'm walking w/ it, when I'm sitting in a cold stand and even under recoil. My primary beat around, don't care if it gets banged up, rifle is a Ruger Model 77 hawkeye SS chambered in 338Federal that I replaced the synthetic stock w/ a Ruger factory ultra light stock from Brownells. The barrel contour was different, so I had to spend some time free floating it, refinishing it (inside and out) and I pillar bedded it. Attractive to my eye, but inexpensive to put together. I carry it as is and accept the occasional ding as another reminder of a great hunt. David

Energizer, Congratulations! Nice moose, good looking Argo/R1! David

Did a monkey do that?

I see, more opinion stated as fact. That's what I thought. David

I've read that before, and note that Chuck states the improved accuracy as a theory - not a fact. There is no supporting data (nor does chuck claim that there is). The OP was specifically asking why WSM's in the Benelli R1 - not why WSM's. There is no evidence of improved accuracy in the Benelli or any other platform and as such I agree w/ the OP - WSM's don't seem like a wise idea in the R1. I have noticed that you often state that the Benelli has "design flaws" that cause inaccuracy - what design flaws are you referring to? My Benelli R1 is as accurate as any 7 pound hunting rifle I've ever owned and more accurate than quite a few. As has been the case w/ almost every rifle I've ever owned, accuracy has improved after sending a couple hundred rounds down the tube. David

The action is not any lighter in the Benelli - it is the same as the full length cases. Bolt action rifles chambered in the WSM's have shorter/lighter actions. Who cares if the stroke is shorter? How does that improve the performance in the Benelli where the action cycles automatically? The steep shoulder angles and rebated rim design of the WSM's cause far more feeding problems than any perceived benefit of the shorter stroke. Short fat cases have been shown be able to produce marginally better accuracy in bench rest competition. That's fine in that rarified world where improvements in group size of a few hundredths of an inch are the difference between winning and losing. In the world of 7 pound hunting rifles w/ sporter barrels the idea that short fat case of the WSM would be more accurate than comparable long action case is laughable - certainly no real world testing supports that conclusion. There's been a lot of testing done - this is typical of the results: http://www.handloadersbench.com/forum5/184.html Please show some test data that supports your statements that the WSM's are more inherently accurate. Yes given the right rifle they are very accurate - so is a 30-06, 300 win mag and way to many other cartridges to mention. David

What is the round count on your 270WSM? My R1 really started shooting better after the round count went over about 250. David

I agree! I'm not a big fan of the WSM's to begin w/ but the whole concept is stupid in the R1. The only point of the WSM's is to get magnum performance in a short action. If the action is the same size and weight, the long action calibers make a lot more sense. I also wish the 9.3x62 was available here (they offer it in the European version). I would buy one if they did. David

Those are some very nice, high quality scopes that are appropriate for your intended application - you will be well pleased w/ all of those! Might I also suggest you look at a Trijicon Accupoint 2.5-10x56 also. Trijicon accupoint scopes have an illuminated reticle that is "always on" and requires no batteries. It uses a combination of fiber optics and tritium. It is in the price range of the scopes you mentioned. I have one on my R1 and have been well pleased. Going to a "big box" outfitter store like Cabelas, Gander Mountain, Bass Pro shops, etc. may be your best opportunity to look through those scopes side by side. It is often difficult to determine quality/performance looking through a scope in a well lit store, but it may help you make a choice nonetheless. I would shop price carefully, before purchasing, many of the online retailers can save you many hundreds of dollars! Here are some that I have done business w/ and been happy with: http://swfa.com/default.aspx http://www.theopticzone.com/ http://www.natchezss.com/ There are many others, however, there is one place I would specifically avoid: http://www.opticsplanet.com/ Customer service is terrible! Google is your friend here, read some reviews.... The picatinny rail mounts to the rifle - there are two little plastic plugs that have to be pushed out of the screwholes. The picatinny rail has built in elevation and must be mounted properly (thinner area forward). The rings will mount directly to the picatinny rail, any rings designated for use w/ weaver bases/picatiny rail will work, as opposed to Leupolds proprietary bases or Ruger's built in factory bases. There are numerous quality ring designs, get steel! I like Talley, Warne and Leupold (yes Leupold makes picatinny style rings as well as rings for the proprietary bases). If you have no experience mounting a scope it may be worthwhile for you to bring it to a gunsmith. If you buy your rifle/scope at smaller professional gun shop they will probably mount your scope for you if you want. I would not let the typical "big box" stores mount my scope. It's not that its terribly difficult, but there are a lot of little things that make a difference! Generally speaking the R1 will work w/ lower rings than you might normally consider due to the picatinny rail. Normally, medium rings are used w/ 40 mm scopes, high w/ 50/56mm. I have my 56mm scope mounted w/ medium rings and have plenty of clearance. If you buy a 40/44mm scope low rings will work well. As a general rule, it is desireable to mount the scope as low on the rifle as possible. HTH David

Where did you learn that Tucker - the same place where you learned about rifle design? It's all a matter of statistics - if you're talking about a representative sample size then you would have to shoot a group of a minimum of 25 shots. Problem w/ shooting that many shots is it starts becoming more a test of the shooter than the equipment as few shooters can maintain the mental discipline required (me included). Despite your unfounded objections to the contrary, 3-shot groups are the accepted norm for accuracy w/ centerfire hunting rifles. The only reason I shot 4 was because that's how many the magazine holds and I wanted to show that my rifle does not have accuracy problems when shooting from the magazine. David

Benelli R1, wood stocks, 20" barrel, 30-06, 150 grn Hornady SST's (factory loaded ammunition). 100 yards, Trijicon 2.5-10x56 @ 10x. Rifle has not been rezeroed in a year, been dissasembled/stripped at least 6 times since zero was established. Brought it to the range to make sure it was still on for hunting season. Rifle now has about 300 rounds down the tube and seems to be getting more accurate w/ more rounds being shot. Shot 2, 3-shot groups well under an inch single loading the rounds. Then remembered all the hulabaloo about supposed accuracy problems when rounds shot from a magazine vs. single loaded, so I shot this group: My son has an identical R1, 30-06, 20" barrel - it will reliably shoot 1" groups at 100 yards, also always holds it's zero between dissasembly and cleaning. Now pushing close to 600 rounds between the rifles, no failures of any kind. Triggers are pretty decent for hunting autoloaders also, particularly my sons rifle. David

Hmmm, no R1's in .338 that I'm aware of - did find this: http://www.vigilancerifles.com/home.html Appears to be based on an R1... David

Experiences vary widely. I have 2 R1's (my son's and mine), both have good triggers, routinely shoot sub 1.5" groups at 100 yards w/ factory ammunition and neither rifle has ever been rezeroed once the final set-up was dialed in. My rifle has been dissassembled and cleaned dozens of times w/ no change in zero, my son's at least a dozen. The thin barrel does heat up rapidly and POA will wander if you don't allow time to cool when shooting groups. Benelli should mention cleaning the piston to ensure reliability, but I always clean mine and have had no corrosion issues. Both of my R1's are very nice rifles, shoot well, perform as expected. David

I wouldn't get too excited about potential problems until you try your rifle. Benelli made some changes over the initial model that seems to have improved things. My son and i have about 500 rounds through our two identical Benelli R1's (30-06 carbines, wood stocks) and have had zero problems. The rifles return to exact POA after each and every strip and reassembly (neither one has required so much as 1 click adjustment on the scope since initial sight in). They are both MOA rifles w/ Hornady 150 grn SST's and they have both taken numerous wild pigs and deer w/ great results! They are relatively light weight and have little recoil. Neither rifle has ever experienced a jam or feed malfunction of any sort. The local dealer where I purchased my rifle is a small dealer w/ lots of repeat customers. He told me he has sold 6 other R1's besides my two and his other customers have had the same experience - no problems, good acuracy, returns to zero. As already mentioned not many folks take the time to post when there are no problems. David

Winchester sxr is the same rifle as the new Browning BAR short trac / long trac, w/ a few minor variations on features. Take down is the same. David

Conducted a little night time hog eradication over the weekend w/ the R1 - dropped this big bruiser free hand in a field w/ the R1. Trijicon 2.5-10x56 optics provide a level of night vision that has to be seen to be believed! Hornady SST 150grn did a great job on this big hog. Sorry about the crappy cell phone pic - only camera I had: David

I've never shot my rifle at the bench single loading - always use the magazine, no problems. I've only tried two types of aamunition: cheapo Winchester PP to sight in the the Hornady SST's. I've had very good performance on game w/ the SST's, when they proved accurate in my rifles I didn't try anything else. The PP's will shoot about 1.5 MOA. David

No, sorry - maybe someone else does. If your dealer has to order it, it will be of the newer design. David

Just re read your post, if your buying new I would make certain that you are getting a newer model ( there have been a few changes since they were introduced). I had my dealer order from Benelli - took 3 weeks 1st time, 4weeks the second - got exactly what I wanted and was worth the wait. David

Every rifle has it's own preferences but the standard Hornady 150grn SST has proven accurate, reliable and a solid performer on game (deer and pigs) w/ our R1's. This is not the most expensive or high tech design but it just flat works for us - may be a good load for you to try. Large feral hog my son took w/ his R1 and the Hornady 150 grn SST's: My son and I w/ our R1's on a hunt this past year: David

I wouldn't get to excited over the negative comments. Benelli seems to have worked most of the issues out. I have two (yes two, one for me and one for my son) in 30.06, 20" barrel wood stock. Both are MOA rifles, both have pretty good triggers (esp. my son's) and nice wood. Both return to zero after cleaning each and every time. Between the two, about 400 rounds fired, zero failures. Sorry you've had problems w/ your Browning, that's unusual particularly the Safari models. I think you will be well pleased w/ the Benelli. David