joshua1240

Maybe? If people are knowingly using ammunition the weapon cannot cycle....why do they own this gun?

Any 12 gauge round between 2 3/4" and 3" with 3 drams of powder will cycle the M4. Less will cause the weapon to require manual cycling, and more will be bled off by the gas system.

You might want to stop answering for others, my statement was not directed at you minus the very last sentence. There is no convo between us and there isn't going to be one.

You're risking your life with a half-assed theory on an internet forum? You lost me there. The trigger and hammer are not being replaced to make the M4 H2O 922r compliant....that's where the idea about these being resold reject parts falls to pieces. They're not, and it's an unnecessary divergance from the real meat of the topic which is "why are these parts not matching the performance and capability of stock parts?" When I get a chance I will post some pictures from another thread that showcases the internals of the trigger group that clarifies this topic a bit. Creating these parts to match the specifications of the manufacturer is as much an art as it is a science. No gun company is going to willingly divulge successful metallurgy, it has to be painstakingly reverse engineered. That's the crux, and that's the real heart of the discussion... and marc63, I have no idea what you are asking me so I'm not even going to try to respond.

You're all over the place with this, please stop. Why would a company, FFT in this case, sell consumers a product that they knew did not meet the specifications of the manufacturer? Or worse, why would that manufacturer resell components they knew did not pass factory tests? Do you really believe that a company would be that dumb or underhanded in a community as tight knit as this one? Your only link for the logic train is that the parts are NP3 coated...so what? There are literally dozens of reasons why this finish would be used, all valid and none of which speak to a conspiracy. You're basically speculating that the H2O is heading out with crap internals...why? To paraphrase RDA1, you don't have any data to support any of your conclusions, you're heaping nonsensical misinformation on a thread about FFT parts and how well perform.

Aside from the hype factor and the limited production, I was drawn to the H2O for it's durability and reliability. If I chose a shotgun for personal protection I want it to be sturdy, flexible in its application and able to withstand the worst kind of stuff thrown at it. I chose the H2O because that is an end of the world gun. You can grab that sucker and walk out your door confident that it's going to keep shooting until you run out of ammo or your arm falls off, and I am betting your arm will fall off first. The collapsing stock is really just a nicety, but it lets me carry a compact weapon that won't make me feel like I am lugging an M16 around again. The full tube is what really does it for me, as well as the consistent reviews of shot patterns at specified distances. All that, and I think it's a sexy looking gun bare bones. It doesn't look like a shotgun. The M2 3Gun looks like it is all about finesse and keeping the guy pulling the trigger happy all day long. It looks like a comfortable gun to fire, and all those built in features keep you on target with no problem. It's definitely a showman/hunter shotgun. I'm picking the H2O because it is bare-bones simple, damn near worry free and reliable like no other semi-auto I have heard of.

Biased just means you are going off of one set of facts based off your particular situation. I'm not using it negatively here. And I hear you about the turn-around, but I am guessing a high-profile weapon like this showing sloppy production methods would be delt with quickly. It'd be like a sports car catching fire three feet out from the factory door...and since the poor workmanship resulted in the weapon malfunctioning you've got twice the speaking power. A bad finish is one thing, a gun that you have to use like a metal club is another entirely for a high profile manufacturer.

I'm really really beginning to believe yours is a fluke. You already said that the metal prep looked badly done and you indicated that the insides seemed to be coated in graphite powder. The curing process for this finish is a bake, and if the metal surface isn't prepped right or the temp is too high or too low the solid bond with the base metal turns into a brittle shell. Benelli will fix it for you since it's a manufacturing mistake, but you can't use your gun as an example of the whole batch. You're working on a biased opinion...and having watched the majority of the H2Os posted for sale and in "look what I got threads" if this was a common issue the community would be buzzing. Have you contacted Benelli?

I can't say ****? H E Double Hockey-Sticks BTW in case I get censored again

Yeah but actually it is just one post, I haven't seen another example of the NP3 finish being described as messed up or spotty. My guess is that if the finish is screwed up, it is covered under the warantee of the gun and will be redone at Benelli's expense. What you get with the H2O far exceeds the cost of the weapon compared with the standard stock M4. You get all of the benefits of the M4 with the tactical stock and the factory full sized tube. You know all of this already, but the NP3 really is just icing on the cake. ****, if the coating is jacked up, the folks who do the NP3 coating now have a new coat that provides all the same protection of the matte grey finish but in black...you could have yourself a factory produced and specially coated unique H2O...but thems is just dreams.

We'll see, and I'll definitely post pics once I get it and do up a proper review since there are some variations between this and a standard M4. I have 200 high brass rounds standing by to break her in.

Sorry to hear you're not happy with the results. You're the second owner I've seen posting about the weapon and the first to identify these concerns. Did you get to fire the gun yet?

I don't know, I'm new to the gun world. I'd hope so, but the H2O isn't the only production gun they're working on, and I am guessing they are tip-toeing with this iteration of the fully fledged combat model. Others here and elsewhere have speculated that it has to do with a desire to first deplete the existing M4 11707 stock, but I don't think that theory holds water due to the backlog of even that gun..they still have orders from last year to fill. I can't say what's up, and I don't want to muddy the waters...just want the gun. I'm thinking, especially with limited production run, these babies are going to retain that high resale value....the waiting game begins.

I ordered mine on the 1st of February and the gun shop said "Oh yeah, those are suppost to be in our store very soon." A month later I called them up to check and got the same response. I don't want to be that guy who calls them every day to check, because really all they can do is place orders with Benelli until Benelli says No Mas. I'm wondering if Benelli knew the demand would shoot up for these right out of the gate. Most online stores were offering these for $2,099.99 as a pre-order and now those same sites have ended the pre-order and marked the gun up from the $2,399.99 to $2,799 price range so obviously the market is adjusting for the demand. I don't mind waiting, but I do not want to wait and have nothing to show for it. I also just went ahead and paid in full so when it comes to the shop it'll be out just as fast and I don't lose the opportunity to have the fully capable M4 I was looking for. Give me a date range for the wait. There's got to be a daily/weekly production rate they (Benelli) can use to gauge when they can fulfil the order backlog. Being in the dark about it kinda stinks.