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Updated Mesa shell carrier/rail info


Creeper
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Got my updated Mesa Tactical shell carrier in the mail today... fits my M2 receiver like a glove and all the mounting holes line up perfect.

 

The new screws and washers are not quite what I expected... actually a lot tricker and fancier than I expected. Mesa went with slotted screws this time around... might prevent (reduce?) over-torquing by them what don't have inch lb. torque wrenches.

The screws have a very shallow countersink and come with very trick, countersink matching, "toothed" lock washers.

I understand the screws are identical to what's used in the M4 1913 rail, but I don't have an M4, so I don't know.

 

Installed the carrier "snug" and checked my barrel fit. Had to buzz about .007" off the end of each screw for adequate clearance. Barrel "just" drops in without contact and I have full thread engagement to the receiver inner surface.

 

A dab of 242 Loctite, 15in.lbs. of torque in a 3 pass, 5in.lb. sequence and it's rock solid.

 

Thats it,

C

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Creeper: How did you remove the excess metal from the screws to allow proper barrel fit. Thanks

 

Measured the screw shanks... they varied about .004" in length to start.

I measured how far the screws protruded thru the action (when fully torqued) with a dial caliper. You could "eyeball" and "finger micrometer" them to length if you take your time. :D

 

The shortest screw was .007" too long, so I removed .007" from it, then matched the rest for length, +/- a thousandth. Sorry... I don't recall the finished length.

 

The way I ground them down without damaging them was to find the appropriate nut that was thinner than the shank, run a screw in until firmly seated, clamp the nut in a small vice-grip and then just "nick" the end on a fine finish wheel.

 

It's not that much to remove, so a file or hard stone... perhaps with the screw in a vice with aluminum soft jaws, that'd be a way to do it fairly quickly and accurately without damaging the screws.

 

All kinda depends on what tools you have available to you. ;)

 

C

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Mesa needs to take better care of their customers instead of blowing them off. I had an issue with my 6 shot carrier for my M4. At first they said it wasn't their fault, blamed it on Benelli and said it was their issue. Then finally decided to admit they had an issue and it probably wasn't Benelli's fault. I sent it back and it took over a month to get a replacement, only to find out it was the exact same one I sent them. I marked it and the screws before I sent it to them and got the same exact one back with the same exact screws. So they never even opened it or looked a it.

Total waste of my time.

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Mesa needs to take better care of their customers instead of blowing them off. I had an issue with my 6 shot carrier for my M4. At first they said it wasn't their fault, blamed it on Benelli and said it was their issue. Then finally decided to admit they had an issue and it probably wasn't Benelli's fault. I sent it back and it took over a month to get a replacement, only to find out it was the exact same one I sent them. I marked it and the screws before I sent it to them and got the same exact one back with the same exact screws. So they never even opened it or looked a it.

Total waste of my time.

 

Wow, that's messed up.

 

I've been pretty underwhelmed with their product offerings, and some stories I've heard have also kept me from purchasing from them.

 

YMMV.

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Mesa needs to take better care of their customers instead of blowing them off. I had an issue with my 6 shot carrier for my M4. At first they said it wasn't their fault, blamed it on Benelli and said it was their issue. Then finally decided to admit they had an issue and it probably wasn't Benelli's fault. I sent it back and it took over a month to get a replacement, only to find out it was the exact same one I sent them. I marked it and the screws before I sent it to them and got the same exact one back with the same exact screws. So they never even opened it or looked a it.

Total waste of my time.

 

I'm not a shill for Mesa Tactical... but I've never had any problems with them or with the person I most often have communicated with, Mitch Payton.

 

I contacted them prior to mounting my carrier, to find out what the mounting issues were that I'd been reading about on the forums... specifically those that caused the carrier to come off, or to strip the screw threads in the receiver.

 

I knew that some issues were going to be caused by customers that over-tightened the screws... but not everyone that had a problem could be discounted as being a ham-fisted orangutan.

 

They determined that the issues they were having with the rail/shell carriers were, most often, related to both screw and countersink inconsistencies.

 

They took steps in (what I consider to be for a production change) a timely manor to improve the mounting system and shipped me my updated unit within a few days of putting the new mounts into production.

This all took place over about a 75 day period from early December to a few days ago.

 

What specifically was your issue (not assuming it was the mounting... ya' never know), and what was the time frame that your difficulties occurred?

 

C

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I'm not one to bash anybody or anybody's product. But it really did upset me that they kept the rail for a month, never even contacted me and when I would contact them it was always we will call you back, then I received back exactly what I sent them. It even still had the tape on the bag where I taped the screws in the little baggie. They would have had to cut the tape to open the bag. So I know they never even looked at it, addressed the issue, or was concerned about it. Its a duty weapon, so I can't have stuff flying off of it when I need it. I also am very meticulous when it comes to torque specs and mounting stuff properly.

What I found out later was the screws that they were using were of very poor quality. Had a high carbon content and the threads rolled over if you tried to tighten then. Also was the countersink issue.

The fact that they didn't want to address it and blamed it on Benelli was pretty poor. Their exact words were Benelli's receivers were out of spec and that was the issue. It wasn't their add on part.

I honestly tried to work it out with them and never was an ass about it, but I guess not being an ass, they felt that they could just blow me off and not address the issue.

I spoke with Mitch about it several times, and it was always we'll call you back. I promise. Well, it's been a few months, and still no call.

You can only do that to so many customers before it finally gets out and starts to hurt your business. But hey, I guess that they have such a large customer base that pissin on one or two customers isn't gonna hurt them.

Oh well, live and learn.....

 

The specific issue was the screws wouldn't stay tight. Before mounting I called Benelli and asked them for torque specs. I was told somewhere between 12 and 15 in/lbs.

After I realized they wouldn't stay tight, I tightened all the screws, pulled the trigger group out and inspected the depth of the screws. None of the screws were deep enough into the receiver.

I then removed all the screws and measured them. The longest screw was 9.75mm. The shortest was 9.27mm. So none of the screws were 10mm in length. This started calls to Mesa. Which at first they told me I measured them wrong, so I re-measured again, and came up with the same measurements. Then the, well, its' Benellis fault scenario started. Finally they admitted they had an issue with the screws and countersinking.

I don't think I had a counter sink issue, but the screws were of poor quality and too short.

 

I ended up ordering some 15mm Stainless Steel screws myself and cut them individually to fit each mounting point just in case there was a countersinking issue. I haven't had an issue since.

 

The time frame was from probably June or July of last yr. till November. So it lasted several months. The last month was where I sent it in and it sat on somebodys' desk and they just waitied a month and sent it back to me to shut me up I guess.

Sometimes paitence is a virtue, but I think I was way too paitent for this issue.

Edited by Lakotah
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Sounds like everything that happened to you happened just before the finally realized the issue was theirs and not Benellis. Sure, there might be a small variation in the receivers, but not several thousandths from one to another. It's always hard to admit that your product has some problems and needs to be revised.

 

When I got my carrier in late November, between the forum threads and the not all too impressive screws that came in the kit... I didn't even bother to mount it.

Instead, I communicated with Mitch via the MT forum and got the whole story... which was right on the leading edge of their becoming aware of the issue.

I boxed up the carrier and sent it off in December.

As I never had it on in the first place, I didn't miss it much while it was gone. :D

 

Sounds to me like you figured out exactly what your issues were and took steps to correct them of your own accord.

 

I'm sorry you had to go thru the ringer with MT. I agree that they aren't the most communicative bunch of boys, but I own a (very) small business myself and can understand how you can develop a mindset that makes you want to limit communication... just the opposite of what you should be doing, but it's a path many small businesses (and large ones too) walk down at some point.

 

MT, in general terms, makes a unique and good quality product, but I suspect they can be stubborn and obstinate when it comes to customer service.

We often expect the best from companies that make a good product, but because they are run by humans, with a whole litany of human failings, you quite often get the worst.

 

Best 'O Luck in the future...

C

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Sometimes a customer will really get on my nerves with dumb questions and what I perceive to be a "smarmy" attitude. I make custom motorcycle seats, entirely by hand... so I have what you might call an "artistic temperament".

 

I have to remember (sometimes not so easy) that although I've heard dumb questions and comments a thousand times, the customer is asking it for the first time, and although it's dull to me, it's completely valid and important to them. So I put on my best smiley face and give them a complete and friendly answer.

 

The "I'm more important than your other customers" attitude... well, that's a different story. The folks that are appreciative and considerate... and aren't even thinking about how they are going to get over on me, those folks get the preferential treatment.

The "I'm special" customers go to the back of the bus... so to speak. :p

 

C

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