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DnJ90

Ammo Question

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Is there anything I can't shoot out of my Nova tactical?I think someone told me I cant shoot anything with a sabot.Is this true/The supernova is all stock if that makes a difference.Thanks

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you can shoot sabots

it's ideal to shoot sabots through a rifled barrel or choke but they'll shoot from your barrel (IC choke, right?)

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It has been my impression that you had to have a rifled slug barrel to shoot a sabot slug:D http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabot It also says that here down in article! do not shoot slugs too much anymore but pretty sure you can't shoot them in a smooth bore shotgun!

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Technically, a smoothbore gun will fire saboted slugs without a problem.

It's a waste of money, time, and energy to do so, because there's nothing to impart spin onto the projectile in a smoothbore.

 

The only other limitations you have with your Nova are the same limitations that apply to all smoothbores with regard to using the right guage shells and the proper choke tubes with certain shot types, like steel.

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Dn,

 

There are some sabot slugs that have fin-like features that impart a spin to round once it leaves the barrell and the sabot peels away (Brenneke Black Magic comes to mind). There are new sabot rounds that will work in both smooth bore and rifled barrels and some fin-stabilized rounds exist (military FRAG-12 and some civilian "exotic" ammo -- but I'm dubious when it comes to the reputation and performance of the latter).

 

Another way to shoot (accurately) sabot slugs from a smooth bore barrel is to use a choke that imparts spin to the round like the Hastings Paradox Sabot Discarding choke. They cost about 60 bucks and I have one on backorder. I've heard of good results with the Paradox and I will post my review once I get mine.

 

-x

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Brenneke Black Magic is not a sabot slug, and has no cover that peels away. It is just a really good rifled slug. Brenneke does make one sabot slug called the SuperSabot. It is also a great slug, but like the others have said, it would be a waste to fire it from anything but a rifled barrel.

 

This said, the Brenneke Black Magic is a super accurate and hard hitting round. My m1014 is used for bear protection, and with the exception of some specialty rounds used to scare bears off, I load them exclusively in my gun.

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Alaska bear is right about the Black Magic. Sometimes (well, most of the time) I think faster than I type. That said, I do like the Black Magic and it is pretty damn accurate out to 75+ yards.

 

AB: what specialty rounds have you used to scare bear? I ask as I have experimented with some exotics as well and had varying amounts of sucess (depending on the type of bear and the varible nature of the engagement). Have you used any OC rounds? I've been fortunate in the 25 years I've lived in Alaska not to have had to shoot a bear in self-defense (as I follow all the common sense rules -- have had some close calls, but no one has had to die).

 

-x

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Topcover--

The specialty rounds we use are Birdfrite Scare Cartridges, or Lightfield Extended Range Rubber Slugs.

 

Our normal set-up is to have the gun loaded with the Brenneke Black Magic Shells for immediate lethal defense.

 

There are also times when we may have an unwanted bear who we can scare off with the Birdfrite shells. These shells are essentially a big firecracker that you shoot from a 12 gauge. You just load them like a regular shell and shoot them in the direction of what you want to scare. They explode and flash a 200'. As the name implies, they where designed to scare birds. They are used around airports and farms. Always use a cylinder choke with the Birdfrites, or your gun could damage the projectile as it leaves the gun. I have never experienced this, but my guess is it would be a bad thing. The Birdfrite shells are generally more expensive ($60 per 25 shells) than some other cracker shells on the market, but way more reliable with super consistent fuses.

The Lightfield Extended Range Rubber Slugs are a good intermediate solution to bears. Sometimes we have a bear that is too close for the Birdfrite shells, or just doesn't care. When you smack a bear in the ass with the rubber slugs, they are pretty much on their way. Even though we sometimes need to use more than one of these specialty shells, our policy is to never load more that one in the gun. In this, the next round is always a hard lead slug-- just in case the aversion therapy does not work and the situation turns bad.

 

The cracker shells and rubber slugs have been used successfully for quite a while in Glacier National Park, Montana.

 

The final "Specialty" round I carry are 12 GA. flares. These really don't have anything to do with bears, but they are handy if needed in an emergency.

 

As you said, using your head is by far the best bear protection. This said, two of the biologist I work with at the Dept of Fish & Game were attacked by a big brown bear two summers ago. The first guy was carrying a rifle that he jammed. The second guy shot the bear twice, stopping it a mere 8 feet from the first guy. Both of these guys were super-competent outdoorsmen who had hundreds of bear encounters that were solved with hand clapping, warning shots and whistles. Sometimes you just have to fall back on the firearms.

 

Hope this was helpful

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Those birdcracker loads are fun. Kinda like shootin' off a mortar round that airbursts. A real funny thing to do is get ya some and ask to see your Buddy's gun to 'admire it' and slip one in while dove or quail hunting and see the look on their face when they shoot at a bird. Probably not advisable if your huntin' pard has a finely refurbished Holland &Holland or a Boss et. al.

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AB,

 

Thanks for the reply and details. You are right on in saying that sometimes you can do everything right and things still go to **** and you have to kill a bear. I have several friends who have had to drop a bruin despite not doing anything to invite an attack. Anyone who thinks they have figured out what a wild animal is thinking simply invites becoming a statistic/meal ala Timothy Treadwell.

 

I've been carrying a couple similar non-lethal loads as you do (fin stabilized rubber baton and bird bombs). I also carry four flare round when out in the wild -- gotta love the utility of shotgun (protection, hunting, rescue, etc.). Have you dabbled with any of the OC/CS rounds (I haven't as I am told they won't cycle in the M4)?

 

I am a journalist (mostly covering science, space and military tech), I'm slowly puting together a story on new/existing 12 ga slugs and special use rounds and their effectiveness for bear protection, personal defense and survival. I'm trying to test every worthy slug round that is for use in smooth bore 12 ga shotguns. I will post the piece on my Web site when I'm done (still a couple months away). Yesterday I received HEVI-SHOT's 3" sabot slug rounds for smooth bore guns. Supposedly, they have some enhanced terminal effectiveness attributes. I'm going to test them against a big pig head and phone books (as I'm tired of screwing with ballistic gelatin). I'll let everyone know how they perform. Also, everyone please feel free to recommend any new and interesting rounds that I could include in the test program (exotic and handload rounds too).

 

-x

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AB,

 

Thanks for the reply and details. You are right on in saying that sometimes you can do everything right and things still go to **** and you have to kill a bear. I have several friends who have had to drop a bruin despite not doing anything to invite an attack. Anyone who thinks they have figured out what a wild animal is thinking simply invites becoming a statistic/meal ala Timothy Treadwell.

 

I've been carrying a couple similar non-lethal loads as you do (fin stabilized rubber baton and bird bombs). I also carry four flare round when out in the wild -- gotta love the utility of shotgun (protection, hunting, rescue, etc.). Have you dabbled with any of the OC/CS rounds (I haven't as I am told they won't cycle in the M4)?

 

I am a journalist (mostly covering science, space and military tech), I'm slowly puting together a story on new/existing 12 ga slugs and special use rounds and their effectiveness for bear protection, personal defense and survival. I'm trying to test every worthy slug round that is for use in smooth bore 12 ga shotguns. I will post the piece on my Web site when I'm done (still a couple months away). Yesterday I received HEVI-SHOT's 3" sabot slug rounds for smooth bore guns. Supposedly, they have some enhanced terminal effectiveness attributes. I'm going to test them against a big pig head and phone books (as I'm tired of screwing with ballistic gelatin). I'll let everyone know how they perform. Also, everyone please feel free to recommend any new and interesting rounds that I could include in the test program (exotic and handload rounds too).

 

-x

 

Federal TruBall's.

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