Morton

I got a good price on some Nobili Sport Italia 00 buck and #4 buck, both of which are high brass rounds. The 00 is 12 pellets per and the #4 has 27. Personally I can live with 6 in the tube and one on the carrier, so the extra wound channels are more important to me. For home defense, most of the time two or three rounds will end the confrontation anyways, so I don't stress about getting 7 in the tube, which BTW mine is a stock 5rd with a 2rd extension. Have you shot any of these? If so, what do you think? I know they're hot rounds at 1290 and 1325fps respectively, but my thinking is with 00 pellets weighing more like light .380 target and the #4 more like .25s, higher velocity seems appropriate.

Notice the phrase, "...it doesn't help with 922r compliance...". I already know it makes no difference because it's not replacing something. Adding a sling, a light, a red dot, none of those things matter when it comes to 922r. However if you are replacing a part that was made in Italy for instance, with one that is made in the US, that helps with 922r inasmuch as you can now replace a part with one made in Italy and not have to worry if the part you're replacing was made in the US or not. You're already one part "in the green" so-to-speak, and have leeway as far as the law is concerned. It's good you brought that up to clarify my statement. There's a lot of confusion about 922r. I got the Botach 2rd extension tube for mine, which is made in America, so it doesn't matter where the original "boar's tit's" extension was made. And if the thing was made in Italy, it wouldn't matter if you got a 2rd extension that was made outside the US: The gun would be unaltered as far as the required number of listed parts being made in the USA. So it's important to know where the part you're replacing was made ONLY if you're going to replace it with a part you know is made outside the US. I love it when a thread digresses to enlighten things.

De nada Rx. As far as I can see there's only one drawback to your piece: it doesn't help with the 922r compliance for American owners. That is if it counts as a part of the gun. Maybe it's a borderline thing?

First pull the bolt all the way back, then ease it forward until the carrier pops up, drop in your round and push it and the carrier down into the receiver and release the bolt. Watch to make sure the bolt doesn't pick up the round. If it does, you must have pulled the bolt back inadvertently. Make sure when you let the bolt forward to make the carrier pop up that you don't pull it back again or it might pick up the round. If you're gonna do this and load a round in the chamber at the same time, it won't matter which you do first, but if you pull the bolt back after you ghost load your round with one in the chamber, the round will jam against the one you put in the chamber. Just FYI.

Good joke. I got a good laugh from that. Thanks.

No problem here. I just posted what I've found to give the guys here a choice, show them how it looks. You came on to tell about an alternative and I'm fine with that. It's what we're here for, right? I didn't even know about that one Dave's makes. But if I had, I think I would have paid more to get this simpler design. All it needs to do is cover the button and to me this is part of the beauty of this weapon: function over form. It's a shotgun you can take all the way apart (except the recoil spring and the magazine assembly) in the dark in the woods and clean it if need be, and not need any tools to do it: It's in the military spirit of the M1 Garand only better. So to me that plain flat piece of spring steel is just what the doctor ordered. The gun doesn't care if it's "pretty", and that piece Dave makes is too fancy for my M4. To me the beauty of the M4 is in it's functionality, and this gun is made for shooting bad guys, not quail. I think if I see somebody put scrolling with gold leaf inlay on their M4 I will die laughing.

None at all, and I think if you did it would hurt the function of it. You have about 1/2" of leeway up or down so you can place it to suit your taste.

Thanks for doing the research for us.

Everybody has his overpriced something. I notice Dave has a 2rd extension tube for $85 and I got one from Botach for $50. Yet having seen it, it looks too overworked. I don't think it needs that stiffening rib in the middle. I like this plain release tab. It's simple and military looking. Then again, what is Dave's "speedbar" made of? The RxArms piece is made of 1095 hardened spring steel: You can't just hammer or bend 1095 spring steel around a die and ship it. I wouldn't call the RxArms piece a ripoff. Not with $350 7rd tubes and $85 extension tubes for the M4 selling like hotcakes. lol

Didn't say it's not good for hunting, I just think of it as a tactical combat weapon. However with the stock ZarZ just showed us and his explanation of what he's doing, I think he'll have a fine shotgun for hunting. I guess my comment was biased a little because of my first shotgun my grandfather gave me when I was ten: a sweet double-barreled Savage 410. I think of the nice walnut stocks and the two rounds I had to put down a squirrel or a rabbit. Nine rounds of #6 going up against a little bunny doesn't quite seem fair. lol Eight rounds of tall 12 pellet 00 buck for use as riot control however is completely fair.

It's something hunters and skeet shooters do to improve the pattern of the shot. The forcing cone has a taper and the longer that taper takes to "size down" the shot charge, the better the pattern of the shot at distance. I wouldn't be interested in doing that to my M4 because it's a combat/riot weapon, not a hunting shotgun as such. I would think if you had enough money to buy a Benelli M4, and you wanted to do some hunting, you might want a gun that's conducive to hunting, that is not with a pistol grip and is better fitted to holding a bead on a bird or rabbit... ...like maybe his Mossbergs? lol As for you ZarZ: I'm sure you can expect the same pattern improvement you got with your other shotguns. I don't see why not.

I just got mine in today and I am quite satisfied with the quality of the piece. As the manufacturer says it simply tucks in between the forearm and it's retaining band. Although it is made in Canada and it's about $50, I think it is a much more durable solution to the "big buttons" offered by other companies. Not only does it not interfere with anything else, it cannot damage the bolt release mechanism and I can easily get three fingers on it as shown. From one who was trained by one of Uncle Sam's Misguided Children, I am very impressed with the ingenuity and military simplicity of this piece: nothing to break or go wrong here.

I removed my 5rd tube just to make the gun into a takedown that will fit into a backpack or suitcase and I don't see any need to use thread locker there. BTW, if you remove the trigger group, you can point a heat gun at the tube from where the trigger group was and it will melt the factory Loctite (R) in less than a minute. I saw the 7rd tubes going for $300 and up and bought a 2rd extension tube for $50 instead. It does the job of making the magazine 7rd capable and makes the job of cleaning out the magazine tube a lot easier too. It clears the barrel lug, and when cleaning out the tube you just put the follower in, then the spring, and then you put the 2rd extension tube over the spring and push it onto the 5rd tube. It very easy to compress the spring and there's no small parts looking to fly 20 yards away if you lose your grip, which is even more unlikely. I can just see somebody slip and fire that follower 1/8 mile away in the dark trying to clean the dirt out of a 7rd magazine tube. That or lose the snap ring sleeve using snap ring pliers, which they will need if they re-glued the tube in the gun, which I can't imagine is really needed in any case. Nope. As far as I'm concerned the 7rd tube is purely for cosmetic purposes and gluing it in place is redundant. Function beats bling in my book.

Mine got here today. As you said, this is a great sling, well worth the $50. I will be getting one for my Ruger PC Carbine.

I just bought an 18" M4 model 11701 and I know this question is off-topic but I do have a trust on a suppressor I got last year and I'm disturbed to hear somebody said I may have waived my 4th Amendment rights when I signed that trust document. Is that true? When I paid the ATF my tax and got an NFA stamp for a suppressor, did I sign away my right to demand a warrant to search my home?

I don't consider the addition of a light, scope or red dot a modification of the firearm itself: I already had a light mounted on an offset holder with the finger pad held on the forestock using a 1/4" wide zip tie that slides forward when disassembling. Oh, and that 2rd tube works perfectly and is the same color as the original. About that: there is no need to unscrew the 2rd extension tube, the barrel will clear it. And it does allow an extra 2rds of short brass, I could put 6rds of short brass and 1rd of this tall NSI #4 buck, but why would I do that? If I'm defending, it seems silly to follow up 2rds of #4 buck with 6rds of #8 steel bird shot. 5 more rounds of #4 buck and a whole crowd of rioters are gonna be doing the SIBSA dance. (That's the S**t! I'm Being Shot At! dance.) Nope, I'm more sure than ever that the 2rd extension tube is the way to go. I don't have to deal with the spring, which is not difficult anyways. But I will be able to clean or clear out the magazine tube if I need to without having to have a pair of snap-ring pliers. (BTW, never oil that tube! Keep it dry and use graphite dry lube if you want.) My M4 is now as the Marine Corps wanted and even better. I can field strip, clean and lubricate the gun, and the magazine tube, with no tools except the "tool" that it comes with: the bolt handle. YouTube has the official Benelli M4 disassembly and assembly videos every owner should see. It's a beautiful design that follows in the tried and true war environment standards of such weapons as the venerable M1 Garand: something you don't even need a screwdriver to maintain battle readiness... only it is MUCH simpler and with bigger parts that make it harder to lose something in the dark. One other thing, off topic. If you want to remove the factory magazine tube, take out the trigger group, and point a heat gun right at the tube from where the trigger group was and it will melt the thread locker in less than a minute. The tube will be too hot to grab bare handed, but a rag will give you enough grip to get it off. I got mine off to turn the gun into a takedown that will fit into a back pack or suitcase. With the way things are beginning to look in Washington (and Ottowa), it might be a good idea to be able to go get a locker at a bus station and put a suitcase in there for storage, that is, not to be seen storing a rifle case or needing a locker that big. Just a traveling salesman putting his sample case away while he stays the night in a motel.

Thanks BallChange. I'm not looking to trick it out too much. I purchased the Benelli because it's an heirloom home defense gun, something I'll give to my grandson. It doesn't need rubber o-rings to function like the AR and I'll never have to worry about shot going through walls to hurt family members as long as I'm shooting #4 buck or smaller. I'm adding 2 more things to it: a paddle style bolt release lever from RxArms that's gonna cover up my American flag and a sling from VikingTactics dot com. I think military with my armory: I never have a round in the chamber unless I'm on alert. So my M4 is sitting there with 4 Nobili Sport Italia #4 buck in the mag and one on top of the carrier. These are some seriously powerful LE shells! 27 #4 pellets coming out at 1325fps! They're tall brass BTW so you can't get 5 in a 5rd tube, but as I said I'm getting the 2rd extension tube (today matter-of-fact) and I'm pretty sure it will then load 6 in the tube (they're not that tall) and have 1 on top of the carrier. In case you're wondering NSI also has some 00 buck shells with 12 pellets going 1290fps. 7 little 2 1/2" long cans of 12ga whoopass should be enough to deter a home invader or two. Hell maybe the sound of me racking that first one might send them a-runnin'.

Welcome brother. I'm a new owner too, took delivery of my model 11701 a week or 10 day ago. Black with a skeleton stock (not collapsible). I had an offset flashlight holder for a picatiny that I put on it. It sets off to the left about an inch and it works just fine. I took a zip tie and put the remote switch on the front stock. I'm sure you can find quite a few vendors to suit your taste. If I center the light on the intruders right shoulder from 10 feet away, I'd put twenty-seven #4 buck pellets in the center of his chest. (I'm told to use #4 buck for home defense. It's probably more lethal but doesn't go through walls as easily as 00 buck does.)

I just went to the site and ordered one as soon as I saw it. I got a black one for my new M4 model 11701.

Thanks for the link alpha 33. I thought it looked much better too, so I bought one. Having read about the big button's potential weakness and seeing this paddle style assist, I'm sure this is a much more durable design, not to mention I'll be able to get two or three fingers on it making the bolt release a breeze.

This is a common misunderstanding, the either or, black or white answer. It's true that "recoil" and "inertia" are synonymous when describing the action of an autoloading shotgun. Gas is the other type. But there is an element of inertia involved in any gas operated system. This is why my brand new M4 won't reload anything, light or hot, unless I hold it tight to my shoulder. The pistons push the bolt carrier back first, unlocking the bolt, and then assisting the gas pressure still inside the barrel in pushing the bolt back to eject the shell. If I try to hold the gun at my hip, this continuing recoil will push the receiver in the same direction the bolt is going and prevent the pistons from fully assisting the ejection. Once it's broken in, I'm told, the bolt won't require as much assist from the pistons and then they will be powerful enough to do the job alone.

Interesting thread. I'm new to the forum. I got my 11701 from Carolina C---b-- last week: paid $2251.98 and have a 2rd mag extension coming from Botach. This is all I plan to do with it, it's just a home defense gun. I'm running Nobili Sport Italia #4 buck in it for now because it was #4 buck and was $1.15 a round. I'm told #4 buck won't go through two layers of sheet rock to hurt family members in the next room. My personal opinion to anybody thinking of buying an M4: I think I got a bargain and that it'll be selling for $3000 before the year is up, that is IF you're even allowed to buy one legally. So get what you can get now while the getting is possible. Am following the advice of some more experienced guys: holding the gun firmly against the shoulder until it's well broken in (200-300rds of 00); NOT looking down the barrel to see why that last round didn't fire. LOL Seriously, hoping to find some new friends and maybe find somebody to justify buying some #8 so I can do some duck hunting... here in Florida. Found out about "2 3/4", what that really means, and why the Nobili Sport Italia ammo won't load 5 rounds into my mag: It's 2 1/2" long BEFORE firing.

It's both, inertial and gas. That's why light loads WILL cycle properly in a brand new M4 if you hold it firmly against your shoulder when firing. Break it in, then you can shoot from the hip.

The 2 round extension will require you to remove the "snap ring", which is more of a spring sleeve, and installing it onto the end of the extension tube. Disassembly will then necessarily involve releasing the magazine spring every time you remove the barrel. I actually prefer this setup because I can completely clean everything except the bolt return spring without needing a tool kit. One of the great things about the M4 is the ability to field strip and clean the weapon using only the bolt handle as your "tool". But it never allowed cleaning the magazine tube or the bolt return tube without snap ring pliers. With my 2 round extension tube, I can at least clean the magazine tube now. The 7rd tubes are getting hard to find and they're quite expensive. As far as I can see the only reason to get one would be either for cosmetic reasons or to not have to deal with the magazine spring, which is not a big deal anyways. But the best reason I have for using the 2rd extension tube instead of getting a 7rd tube is for camouflage purposes. (?) Here's what you do: Paint stripes on it to look like the stock tube you have now. A knowledgeable terrorist will see it from a distance and think to himself, "That guy has a maximum of 7 rounds before he has to reload.", when in fact you have 9. heh heh

There's a bit of misunderstanding about the shell size and how many the M4 can load. If a shell is billed as 2-3/4" shell, that means that after it is fired, the plastic (or paper) left over will be 2-3/4" long from the base of the shell. For instance I have some Wolf 2-3/4" shells with #8 shot in them and they are exactly 2-1/4" long before they're fired. My M4 is a model 11701, a 5+1+1, and I can load 5 of these in the magazine. I also have some Nobel Sport Italia 2-3/4" #4 buck and those are almost 2-1/2" long before being fired. I can load only 4 of them in the mag. A "special" spring might let you load a slightly longer shell, but it's not really about the spring, it's about the ammo. I can actually load 4 of the 2-1/4" long Wolf bird shot shells and one of the 2-1/2' Nobel Sport Italia #4 buck without 1/8" to spare. But both are called 2-3/4" shells, and that's where so much misunderstanding comes from. I'd like us to start a sticky thread where we can register different brands of ammo and have the exact sizes listed so we can choose ammo that will fit the stated mag sizes. As I alluded to, it seems the 5 shot tube on my model 11701 will hold a total of 11-3/4" of shells or 5 shells just a shade over 2-1/3" long each.