STA

Just read this forum apparently.

This did make at least one appearance, on a TV show of all things. I posted pics here about 18 months ago. http://www.benelliusa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8916

If you can download these vids, they may show what I was referring to with the TAP loads. The first video shows the Federal low recoil 00 buckshot .. I can't remember if these were the 8 or 9 pellet loads. Note the rather gentle ejection. Federal LR buckshot The next is the Federal low recoil slugs in the blue hulls. A little more umph to them but not bad. Federal LR slugs The final video is the Hornady TAP 00 buck. Note the more prominent flash, blast and more vigorous ejection. Hornady TAP 00 buckshot And finally, a few more rounds of Hornady TAP. Hornady TAP [ 10-12-2006, 05:39 AM: Message edited by: STA ]

Actually in comparing various 'tactical' or low recoil rounds in my M4, the one that stood out for it's large muzzle flash was the Hornady TAP as shown below on an indoor range. The TAP seems to be mid-level, falling between the other low-recoil police loads (1150-1200 fps) and full power buckshot (1600 fps+). It works 100% and I would trust it completely, but I have always found it to have significantly more flash, blast and recoil than any of the Federal or Remington low recoil loads I've tried.

Is this the same BATFE that scares Benelli so bad that they won't even sell a mag extension for a Nova PUMP gun ? The BATF that tells Benelli they cannot import the M1 or M2 practicals that do not have pistol grips, yet continues to allow fully legal sales of the imported, standard stocked, +5 round magazine tubed FN SLPs and Winchester Super X2 Practicals ? Yes, the BATFE is always a reliable source of information. [ 10-10-2006, 11:59 PM: Message edited by: STA ]

Last year on Sighting In, they took a tour of the Benelli factory where they showed them using LoxEal 83-55 to secure the mag tubes. This should be roughly equivalent of Loctite 271 (Red).

Yes, there was a M3 specific extension. "80204P- 2 Shot Magazine Extension, Matte Black - fits M3 ONLY, 12 Gauge" Good luck searching for one.

Guess it's official now. Not a competitor now but a fellow team member. "Tim Bradley Joins Team Benelli as Newest Exhibition Shooter ACCOKEEK, MD (July 10, 2006) –– Benelli USA, an acknowledged leader in the firearms industry, has named Tim Bradley as its newest exhibition shooter at its headquarters in Maryland. Bradley learned to shoot at an early age. Growing up on his family’s farm in northeast Arkansas gave him the opportunity to shoot almost everyday. He devoted every spare minute to hunting, trapping, and shooting, often burning up five or six cases of .22 ammo a year. During his high school years Bradley became interested in boxing and martial arts, earning his black belt in karate at the age of 17. Utilizing the discipline he learned from the martial arts and his ability for mastering extreme challenges, upon completion of his education, Bradley tackled the unique and difficult requirements for becoming a modern-day bounty hunter. Honing his gun handling skills for the specific demands of rounding up bad guys sparked an interest in Bradley for exhibition shooting. During extensive practice sessions Bradley used a training method whereupon mastering one challenging shot, he constantly pushed the envelope to master the next more difficult shot. Only after years of practice and firing thousands upon thousands of rounds were Bradley’s talents recognized by non other than Tom Knapp, Team Benelli USA’s World Record-holding exhibition shooter. Determination and dedication to perfecting specific shooting skills finally paid off for Bradley, who was invited by Knapp and Benelli’s VP of Marketing & Communications, Stephen McKelvain to join Team Benelli’s busy 2006 shooting exhibition schedule. “I’m very excited to be joining Team Benelli and sharing the spotlight with such a legendary shooter as Tom Knapp,” Bradley said, “because this gives me the opportunity to draw on my skills and talents to demonstrate how dynamic and dependable Benelli’s guns really are. Tom and I drive these guns much harder than the average shooter ever could. When we pull the trigger, no matter how fast, we know these guns will go bang every time.” “We’re very pleased to have such a talented shooter joining the Benelli ranks. We believe that, along with champion shooter Tom Knapp, Bradley will showcase Benelli’s many fine shotguns in the most exciting and thrilling way. Tim will stand as a fine ambassador for the shooting sports and as an inspiration to young shooters everywhere,” stated Steve McKelvain, Benelli USA’s VP of Marketing & Communications." Press Release doc

This Beretta shooter is Tim Bradley. Tim appeared alongside Tom Knapp last month at Raahauges here in SoCal, first having his own show, then joining Tom at the end for dueling Benellis. Tom and Tim Pt 1 Tom and Tim Pt 2 Tom's finale

Per CA 12276.1, the following is regulated as an "assault weapon". (6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following: (A) A folding or telescoping stock. (B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip. The 2 round extension is not illegal under CA law. The skeleton stock when installed on the 11707 M4 is covered under 12276.1 (6) due to the milled recoil spring tube which allows the stock to collapse. There has been some contention on the status of the skeleton stock when installed on the 11701 commemerative M1014. The recoil spring tube is milled to allow the stock to be attached to the weapon in the full open position, but is not milled to allow the stock to telescope to the full collapsed position. The M1014 was originally offered for sale in CA and is still openly transferred on the used market. The most notable case of the 11701 M1014 stock issue came about when the CA gunstore chain Turners posted a notice wherein Benelli voluntarily ceased sales due to CA DOJ's 'concerns' (... sounds familiar to Benelli ceasing sales of their mag extensions). Turners March 2004 Letter "The California Attorney General's Office has recently examined the design of the Benelli M1014 Limited Edition Shotgun. Although the Attorney General has not stated that the design includes a telescoping stock such that it can be classified as an assault weapon under California law, the Attorney General has expressed some concern about the ability of the user to manipulate the stock by one inch forward and backward (even though the manipulation also involves the rotation of the stock.) The Federal Government has already informed Benelli USA that it has no concerns in the regard, however because of the reservations expressed by the California Attorney General, Benelli USA will immediately cease sale of the M1014 Limited Edition Shotgun in California. In addition, the yet-to-be-released Benelli M4 (with the same stock design as the M1014 Limited Edition Shotgun) will not be sold in California. Customers can still buy the M4 Pistol Grip and M4 Standard (with field stock)."

Brownells now lists this M4 Lightweight Charging Handle from PMT, in titanium no less.

I did this little exercise 8 months ago when I got tired of hearing this factoid for the umpteenth time. I measured my M1014 (11701) and M4 (11703) barrel O.D.s with my dial calipers, picking several spots along the tapered barrel lengths for comparison. M1014 _____ M4 1.260" _____ 1.265" - Barrel extension collar as it enters the receiver 1.157" _____ 1.155" - Barrel immediately in front of bbl extension collar 0.868" _____ 0.863" - Barrel at the front of the handguard 0.837" _____ 0.832" - Centered over magazine tube threads, halfway between handguard and front sight 0.922" _____ 0.918" - Barrel below the front sight assembly 0.922" _____ 0.922" - Barrel at the muzzle 0.702" _____ 0.702" - Bore I.D. (M1014 fixed, M4 using the modified screw-in choke) From this, I would hardly say the M1014 barrel is 'heavier'. I'm writing off any differences due to individual tolerances and my poor technique of wrestling the 8 lb shotgun in one hand and the calipers in the other. The M1014 really does appear heavier when viewed from the muzzle due to the fixed choke/solid barrel wall, but simple measurement dispels this 'fact' easily.

Just a reminder for any Benelli fans in Southern California, Tom Knapp is performing this weekend June 3 and 4 at Raahauge's Shooting & Hunting Sports Fair in Norco. I just called and Tom is scheduled to perform both days at 1PM. They said at noon is a new shooter from Benelli who Tom helps out in the show, then Tom's full show is at 1. I have no idea who this new shooter is (maybe getting new blood ready for if/when Tom retires ??) Also Jerry Miculek is not attending now, but Todd Jarrett's show is at 3. More details here: http://www.raahauges.com/sportsfair.htm

Any word yet how the 1202 will work with the civilian magazine extensions where it steps up from 25.5 to 27.5mm ??

Another one from their training sessions.

On re-reading my post, I can see how it could get confusing on what I was asking, so I am attaching a pic from my M4 showing the optional magazine extension in place with the dimensions. From this, you can see why I was asking if your laser/light unit would have problems fitting the civilian guns due to the thicker skirt covering the threaded connection between the tubes.

Thanks for the interesting pics. Is this the same 1202 unit your site lists as for the 870, or are you making any changes for the M4 ? I see this mounted on the military M4. The civilian M4 has the two piece magazine tube, and it looks like your sight would have to be placed right where the overlapped threaded section is on our M4s. Will your units work on this oversized section of the two piece civilian tubes or only the straight mil spec tubes ?

Well Cal's made the price increase today. I sent my buddy the link about 11AM PST when it still showed them in stock at $100. By 4 PM, they revised it to $125 and indicated none left. What is more interesting is the reversal in Cal's position and their removal of this disclaimer which appeared the end of last year. November 2, 2005 "Until further notice, BenelliUSA will cease all sales, marketing and use of magazine tube extensions imported or sold under the Benelli, Franchi and Stoeger brands. BenelliUSA will allow magazine extensions to be supplied by way of tax-exempt sales to law enforcement and government agencies only. The dealer of such a sale will have to supply a letter to BenelliUSA confirming the final destination of the magazine tube extension(s). If you have questions regarding this new BenelliUSA policy please call (301)283-6981." I wonder with all the profiteering taking place, did Cal's decide to get in on the action, or has something new come down from the Benelli mountaintop??

The key is the threaded collar from the Nova extension kit, #80201P. Unlike the M1 collars, the Nova collar has a smaller inside thread that attaches to the mag tube coming from the receiver. This thread size happens to match the thread on the end of the M4 tube, whether it's from the EU full military type, or the US 81043P extension. The outer thread of the Nova collar is the larger thread size that fits the Nova or M1 type extensions. The Nova collar also has the serrated teeth like the original M4 nut so it can lock against the ball detent in the barrel ring. The net effect is that the Nova collar will lock the M4 barrel in place but leave the end open to accept any older Benelli extension. Here's a pic with the Nova extension in place. A more sensible approach may be to use the shorter stub extension from the newer M1s or you could go completly mad and add the extension from a M1 Practical (if you aren't afraid of shooting it off).

Rebuilding a Benelli to make it compliant? Why not just get an Winchester Super X2 Practical or FN Self-loading Police - these are imported, have full length mag tubes and are compliant/legal as they are available for sale everywhere. If only this were an April Fool's post ...

Just looked at SRM's site. With their M4 extension, you now have to remove the collar, extension and spring just to be able to field strip and remove the barrel. It took SRM this long to 'design' such an alternative? Looks more like a stop gap approach to keep the price point in line with the previous Benelli tube while making it easy (and more profitable) for SRM to produce. A big thumbs down. Looks like factory Benelli or Nodak tubes will still fetch a premium.

Stockplayer, you're not doing anything wrong by leaving that 'non functional' clip in place. It serves the very nice function of controlling the mag spring during dis/assembly. I leave mine in place and can get 7+1+1 without problems. One thing you may want to check is that for any 2-3/4" shell, there may be around 1/16" variance in length depending on brand or type of shell. After 6 rounds, that slight over length adds up to 3/8" which may prevent a seventh shell from fully entering the tube. Switching to another brand or type such as from slugs to buck may allow you to get that 7th round in.

This is an old picture on Impact. Use wayback to see it appeared back in Oct '04. Additionally it is fake. Check the serial numbers on the barrel (TM04498 or 4499?) and receiver (Y004471). Now go to Benelli's own site and look at the close ups for the standard and pistol gripped M4s. http://www.benelliusa.com/firearms/large.tpl?Image=m4-std-large.jpg http://www.benelliusa.com/firearms/large.tpl?Image=m4-pistolgrip-large.jpg Yes, the same exact numbers. Benelli changed the stock on the gun to take two separate pics. The one on Impact is faked by moving the front lug back on the barrel. You can clearly see shading changes where the lug was moved back to make it appear as though the barrel was modified. Here is the same M4 in it's many appearances. The top two are from the BenelliUSA site, the third is Impact's modified image, and the last is one I found saved on my pc (I think also from Impact last year) where they had added the m4 L.E. marking on the same receiver. Nothing sad about it when all you need to do is some legwork to find the facts.

The new M4 I showed was a 11707 and it has the standard barrel lug configuration with the dummy extension. Its fully capable of accepting the 2 round extension provided you can find one. The pic you refer to is from Impact and it is a old fake that goes back to '04. The base gun is that which is shown on Benelli's own site. What's ooooooohhhhhhh so sad is the way this disinformation propogates on the net without anyone doing some research before they comment on it.

It looks like the latest batch of M4s have had more changes to the barrels, in this case additions to the barrel extension. I noticed on pics of the recent guns online that there appeared to be a flange where the barrel enters the receiver. I had a chance to examine three new M4's this weekend and saw they indeed have added a flange on the extension that bears against the front of the receiver. It looks like it may be to limit the barrel travel into the receiver or simply protect or cover up the front of the receiver. The other change was on the end of the extension inside the receiver. They have added a wedge that mimics the shape of the ejection port. I thought perhaps it was matched even with the edge of the port to protect the Aluminum receiver, however when installed it is about 1/4" behind the port. I couldn't detect any changes inside the receiver with a quick glance, so I'm not sure if they made any changes to the machining inside the receiver though I do not believe so. The older barrel style (up through TM12200 at least) is on the left, the newer barrel is on the right (ca TM14600). Final pic shows the flange against the receiver.