heckler&kochp2000 Posted April 8, 2011 Share Posted April 8, 2011 (edited) No FFL Required All NFA rules apply http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=224051198 Get them before there gone Edited April 8, 2011 by heckler&kochp2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acolar Posted April 8, 2011 Share Posted April 8, 2011 where can the appropriate length magazine tube be found? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckler&kochp2000 Posted April 8, 2011 Author Share Posted April 8, 2011 (edited) where can the appropriate length magazine tube be found? It uses the short magazine and spring that come with a m4 with out the dummy extension. Edited April 11, 2011 by heckler&kochp2000 Spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tac Airlift Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Are they only available for sale on gunbroker.com? I remember reading a separate post wherein you indicated they were $1025.00 including shipping that did not reference the gunbroker listing. I don't have pm or email access as yet. If you could reply to my email address it would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel333 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 does this have to be registered with ATF before installing on my shotgun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 does this have to be registered with ATF before installing on my shotgun? Yes, yes, and **** yes. He posted right off the bat that ALL NFA rules apply. That means you will have to do the proper registration process BEFORE you install the new barrel. Your best bet is to get with one of your local shops to walk you through the NFA process in you aren't already familiar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broken Legend Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Your shotgun needs to be registered as a short barreled shotgun for you to put it on. I think that you would need to store that part at a separate location until your paperwork comes in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel333 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Your shotgun needs to be registered as a short barreled shotgun for you to put it on. I think that you would need to store that part at a separate location until your paperwork comes in. thats what I figured Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steven765 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Yet these don't have to be shipped to an FFL? Soo if you hide it in your basement forever you're set when the zombies come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCKETW19 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Your shotgun needs to be registered as a short barreled shotgun for you to put it on. I think that you would need to store that part at a separate location until your paperwork comes in. you dont need the barrel at a different location. it is not a SBS if the barrel is not on the gun. It is just a barrel setting in your safe. If LE is in your house asking why you have a lil barrel you have more to worrie about I would guess. I probably would leave it somewhere else just to stop you from putting it on real quick and posting pics on the net,lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 you dont need the barrel at a different location. it is not a SBS if the barrel is not on the gun. It is just a barrel setting in your safe. If LE is in your house asking why you have a lil barrel you have more to worrie about I would guess. I probably would leave it somewhere else just to stop you from putting it on real quick and posting pics on the net,lol What you are suggesting is a felony under "Constructive Possession". A disassembled SBS that is in your possession is the same condition as an assembled SBS under this legal doctrine. Leaving the barrel at your friends house would avoid the CP issue, but unless you are planning to Form 1 the SBS, then what's the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCKETW19 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 What you are suggesting is a felony under "Constructive Possession". A disassembled SBS that is in your possession is the same condition as an assembled SBS under this legal doctrine. Leaving the barrel at your friends house would avoid the CP issue, but unless you are planning to Form 1 the SBS, then what's the point? Ya I dont buy that. But hey I am no laywer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 What I was told by a Class III dealer here is that it would be in my best interest to keep the barrel in a different location than the gun I was going to convert. Ideally, you are supposed to begin the NFA process before you acquire parts and do any assembly. Once you have paperwork in-hand, get your parts and go at it. That said, he also told me that having the barrel is not really a big deal. I can keep it in my shop and if my M4 lives in the house, then I'm fine. I feel pretty comfortable since I have an extended mag tube on my M4. As long as it stays configured that way, I couldn't put a short barrel on there anyway. On the outside chance that I might get a visit, it would be pretty clear that I couldn't use the short barrel without a bit of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCKETW19 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 What I was told by a Class III dealer here is that it would be in my best interest to keep the barrel in a different location than the gun I was going to convert. Ideally, you are supposed to begin the NFA process before you acquire parts and do any assembly. Once you have paperwork in-hand, get your parts and go at it. That said, he also told me that having the barrel is not really a big deal. I can keep it in my shop and if my M4 lives in the house, then I'm fine. I feel pretty comfortable since I have an extended mag tube on my M4. As long as it stays configured that way, I couldn't put a short barrel on there anyway. On the outside chance that I might get a visit, it would be pretty clear that I couldn't use the short barrel without a bit of work. I can agree with this as less hassel this way but I do not "think" you can get in trouble for just a barrel. I am asking my FFL right now (just sent email) so I will see what he says Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M4Madness Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 http://www.guntrustlawyer.com/2009/08/florida-man-arrested-for-const.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCKETW19 Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 http://www.guntrustlawyer.com/2009/08/florida-man-arrested-for-const.html very intresting but it clearly say "Florida" law. It also lead me to belive the guy was selling a complete SBR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M4Madness Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 (edited) The stock was NOT attached, but rather in his possession along with the pistol. To quote the article: "However, because he also had a stock, the pistol would have to be registered as a short-barreled rifle, PRIOR to purchasing or possessing the shoulder stock and/or vertical grip." http://blog.princelaw.com/2009/9/1/florida-man-arrested-for-constructive-possession-of-an-sbr Florida law or federal law, I wouldn't possess a short barrel for my M4 unless it was already registered as an SBS. That advice is coming from someone who owns and M16 and four sound suppressors and is more than casually experienced with NFA items. Then again, I've seen many M4 owners who could care less about 922® either. I sold two Benelli shotguns (M1014 and 11707) in the past merely because I couldn't physically or legally install a telescoping stock and full-length magazine tube on them. The only reason I'm back in the M4 game today is that we are on the threshhold of compliance parts being available. Edited April 11, 2011 by M4Madness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tac Airlift Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I spent a couple of hours last night reading thru all the posts on "guntrustlawer.com" and additional posts on "ar15.com" where he also answers NFA questions. On ar15.com he was asked as to the fee to set up a NFA Gun Trust. His reply was $600.00. He went into all of the advantages of establishing a gun trust versus submitting a Form 1 or Form 4 as applicable without the trust. The gun trust allows you to avoid the 'CLEO" approval if that is a road block in your locality. Both sites are quite informative relative to SBR and SBS guidelines and approval. Clearly getting ATF approval for a Benelli M4 14 inch barrel beyond the initial cost of the barrel;+ tax stamp;+ NFA Gun Trust; if you go that route, is a killer if you only intend to purchase one SBS barrel. Is it worth it for the 14 inch Benelli I don't know, I'm trying to convince myself as we speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I can agree with this as less hassel this way but I do not "think" you can get in trouble for just a barrel. I am asking my FFL right now (just sent email) so I will see what he says No, you can't really get in trouble for "just a barrel" unless you make it look like you are doing something sketchy. I have the good fortune to live in a state with great gun laws. I also live in a county where the Sheriff Looks fondly upon those who go through he trouble to get a CCL and will most likely sign off on your NFA because of it. I'm not the least bit worried. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 bump for a good seller! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerDanger Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 The guntrustlawyers are good guys. It's worth the 600$. Surely, you won't just build a short barreled Benelli. You'll add to the collection of fun toys. Suppressors, Short barreled shotguns and short barreled rifles are easily affordable afterwards. Multiple individuals can be added to the trust. Plus the path to transferring your assets to other family or friends in the event of your death are important aspects to consider. Avoiding the need for a CLEO is very helpful when yours is a douche. Your paperwork will also be processed a little faster since finger printing won't have to be processed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M4Madness Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 So if you hide it in your basement forever you're set when the zombies come. If someone wants a 14" Benelli barrel just to hide back until such time as a SHTF scenario occurs and the government is no longer in control, they'd be much better off to wait until that time comes and take a hacksaw to their 18" barrel and leave the 14" barrels to those who wish to legally use them right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decodence Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 What you are suggesting is a felony under "Constructive Possession". A disassembled SBS that is in your possession is the same condition as an assembled SBS under this legal doctrine. Excuse me? In that situation, I'm in possession of weapons of mass distruction under constructive possession just with what is under my kitchen sink and behind the toilet. WTF are you smoking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Oh the wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Excuse me? In that situation, I'm in possession of weapons of mass distruction under constructive possession just with what is under my kitchen sink and behind the toilet. WTF are you smoking? Sounds like several people here don't know much about the NFA. A short barrel is just a part, yes. Completely unregulated. However, if you also possess a compatible firearm and no path to the legal use of that short barrel, then you are in violation under Constructive Possession. A disassembled short-barreled shotgun and an assembled short-barrel shotgun are precisely the same thing under the law. See US v Thompson/Center Arms Co. This case affirms Constructive Possession for NFA firearms, however it clarifies that CP does not apply if there is a legal pathway for the use of the NFA-specific part. In other words, hypothetically, if you owned a complete M4 shotgun and bought and possessed this 14" M4 barrel, then, without an approved Form 1 for the SBS, you would have no legal path to the use of that 14" M4 barrel and would therefore be in violation under CP. Your actual intent behind possessing and using the barrel is irrelevant to the charge. This applies to NFA firearms across the board, to include full-auto fire control parts and a compatible semi-auto firearm. If they catch you with a semi-auto AR15 and a set of M16 fire control parts in your possession, even if not installed in the rifle, CP allows LE to disassemble your AR, install those M16 parts and try to make the rifle fire a second round with a single trigger pull (which is easy to do). When they are successful, you can be arrested and charged with possession of an unregistered machine gun. That's how it works. The only exception to this are "silencers", which have no CP applicability simply because an individual suppressor part (tube, baffle, end cap, etc) is defined as a "silencer" by itself. And there is plenty of case law to back up CP as it pertains to NFA, both state and fed. Seek it out and read it before concluding it's not real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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