New to the Shotgun world, M4 ammo question

[analoglife76]

Although I've been shooting for a while, I just got my first shotgun, Benelli M4. 

Looking for a recommendation for ammo for target practice (slugs, or 00 buck) and for home defense. 
Thanks in advance!

[ArizonaM4]

I'd say the cheapest slugs/buck you can find is great for target practice.  I avoid low recoil though because I like to feel it.  I'll also shoot the cheapest birdshot no problem.  Never had an FTE with birdshot or target loads.

For home defense.  Hornady Critical Defense 00.  

[benelliwerkes]

For home defense fully expect that you will be held accountable, both at civil and criminal law levels, for all 9-12 .30 caliber rounds contained in your 12 ga. "00" buckshot cartridge. One intended target miss and there they go down range thru the housing dry walls, a long way, into adjacent room spaces, your neighbors bedroom, etc.  Unless the bad guy is charging into your home, and why would you be there with your loaded 12 ga. shotgun waiting to ambush him? Shooting the retreating bad guy in the back as he is retreating may be tempting at the moment, hope you can afford to defend the local zealot prosecutor on homicide charges. First off, you could throw a firecracker at most home-invading crackers, and they would scatter away like rats. Consider #4 or #6 shot shells for home defense, especially in 12 gauge; more than enough fire power to thwart a rat, and the individual shot will most likely not exit your domicile to harm other innocents. Can't imagine even the rationale for using a slug for home defense. Just as FBI studies have concluded a M4 in 5.56 is safer on interior encounters than their 9mm pistols for over-penetration.

Here's a 18" Winchester 1200 pump ("world's fastest pat 2ump shotgun") training at the elite Rogers Shooting School, using # 6 shot, slamming down head plates at 25 yards......it's more than adequate for home defenses.  "00" buckshot is used for final testing, to make the student has acquired proper recoil management. Just sayin'.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/rcco1d1f5ery84ndnlkh9/Rogers-School-Shotgun-Shooting-Test-4-copy.mp4?rlkey=1f8hx8qd49qald62pvr1ojp17&dl=0

Edited February 2, 2024 by benelliwerkes

[Sukhoi_fan]

 

Quote

Shooting the retreating bad guy in the back as he is retreating may be tempting at the moment

In Texas it's perfectly legal for a 'reasonable person' to shoot a fleeing thief at night (I know of one case locally several years ago where a homeowner shot a fleeing thief in the back at night with a shotgun killing him and the grand jury no billed him [the varmint was attempting to steal a car stereo], there was also a case in Houston where someone getting their truck repossessed in the wee hours of the morning shot the repo guy in the back with a .30-30 as he was driving off,  killing him - the Harris County grand jury no billed that guy as well, in both instances the shooters were protecting their own property from theft at night [one cannot legally use deadly force to protect someone else's property in Texas]). Additionally, in Texas it's legal to shoot arsonists day or night.

[benelliwerkes]

47 minutes ago, Sukhoi_fan said:

 

In Texas it's perfectly legal for a 'reasonable person' to shoot a fleeing thief at night (I know of one case locally several years ago where a homeowner shot a fleeing thief in the back at night with a shotgun killing him and the grand jury no billed him

Well then, it's indeed handy to know your local laws!  Did the thief drop the TV ?

[Ceephus]

1 hour ago, Sukhoi_fan said:

 

In Texas it's perfectly legal for a 'reasonable person' to shoot a fleeing thief at night (I know of one case locally several years ago where a homeowner shot a fleeing thief in the back at night with a shotgun killing him and the grand jury no billed him [the varmint was attempting to steal a car stereo], there was also a case in Houston where someone getting their truck repossessed in the wee hours of the morning shot the repo guy in the back with a .30-30 as he was driving off,  killing him - the Harris County grand jury no billed that guy as well, in both instances the shooters were protecting their own property from theft at night [one cannot legally use deadly force to protect someone else's property in Texas]). Additionally, in Texas it's legal to shoot arsonists day or night.

...... Arsonists day and night you say... 🤔

[Sukhoi_fan]

1 hour ago, benelliwerkes said:

Well then, it's indeed handy to know your local laws!  Did the thief drop the TV ?

Indeed, it's VERY important to know local laws, and whether or not you have a woke Soros DA. The criminal in the first case had broken into a SUV to steal the stereo in the wee hours of the AM, the homeowner was awakened by activity in his carport, stepped out with his shotgun and nailed him square in the back which fleeing up the driveway. Unknown about whether he had the car stereo in hand when nailed, however I don't think actually seeing the thief with stolen goods in hand is a pre-requisite to doing a service to the community (I think the law says something law says something like 'a reasonable person who reasonably believes' a thief is making off with one's stuff between the hours of sunset and sunrise - NOT legal advice, DYODD! Remember: shooting a bad guy who deserves it is easy, the aftermath is the problem, which is why deescalation is important as is creating distance.)

[John P.]

3 hours ago, benelliwerkes said:

For home defense fully expect that you will be held accountable, both at civil and criminal law levels, for all 9-12 .30 caliber rounds contained in your 12 ga. "00" buckshot cartridge. One intended target miss and there they go down range thru the housing dry walls, a long way, into adjacent room spaces, your neighbors bedroom, etc.  Unless the bad guy is charging into your home, and why would you be there with your loaded 12 ga. shotgun waiting to ambush him? Shooting the retreating bad guy in the back as he is retreating may be tempting at the moment, hope you can afford to defend the local zealot prosecutor on homicide charges. First off, you could throw a firecracker at most home-invading crackers, and they would scatter away like rats. Consider #4 or #6 shot shells for home defense, especially in 12 gauge; more than enough fire power to thwart a rat, and the individual shot will most likely not exit your domicile to harm other innocents. Can't imagine even the rationale for using a slug for home defense. Just as FBI studies have concluded a M4 in 5.56 is safer on interior encounters than their 9mm pistols for over-penetration.

Here's a 18" Winchester 1200 pump ("world's fastest pat 2ump shotgun") training at the elite Rogers Shooting School, using # 6 shot, slamming down head plates at 25 yards......it's more than adequate for home defenses.  "00" buckshot is used for final testing, to make the student has acquired proper recoil management. Just sayin'.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/rcco1d1f5ery84ndnlkh9/Rogers-School-Shotgun-Shooting-Test-4-copy.mp4?rlkey=1f8hx8qd49qald62pvr1ojp17&dl=0

You okay, bro?

[Sukhoi_fan]

My two cents on ammo:

I avoid shooting slugs because I don't like have to clean the lead out of my barrel, major PITA. I prefer DDupleks over Foster or Brenneke slugs.

I suggest using 2 3/4" rounds, the cost of 3" rounds is just not worth the extra expense when 2 3/4" has pretty much the same effect IMO.

Practice ammo - the cheapest you can get, whether bird shot or 00 buck. Check out www.ammoseek.com if you haven't already. 

Home defense/neighborhood watch ammo - my first preference is Federal 00 buck Law Enforcement rounds with FliteControl in either Low Recoil 1,145 fps or 1,325 fps, however there are other 00 buck options that are equally suitable for dangerous varmints from quality manufacturers such as Winchester, Hornady, Federal (not FliteControl), Fiocchi, Nobel Sport, S&B, Black Aces, and Remington. One consideration is how much recoil you're willing to deal with, and you can gauge the recoil by the velocity in fps. When in a storm and injured, using higher velocity rounds with greater recoil to manage might not turn out so well. Hanging onto a shotgun while shooting 1,600 fps Hornady rounds if one is weak from being gravely injured will be a challenge. For those concerned about blasting 00 buck through walls and hitting innocent parties IMO the minimum for that application would be #4 buck shot, which is typically 27 .22 caliber pellets. For self defense one should only use any 12 ga. ammo which is suitable for KILLING animals from 50-300 lbs., anything less lethal is subject to causing you a problem IMO. I'm also a big fan of 000 buck for home defense ammo.

Drone elimination ammo - I had been thinking that #4 buck would be optimum, but larger buck shot will have greater range, so it's a trade off.

 

 

[Evolution]

Won't give advice on what ammo anyone should use with a 12ga for home defense. But as already mentioned....best to be thoroughly informed about your local laws.

In any case, IMO nowadays with all that has happened in the world of "justice" I would not COUNT on anything shaking out fairly even in a justified home defense shooting. What state you reside in can make a difference. 

So many freak DA's and judges have been insidiously infiltrated into the system now to the point where the scales are tipped disastrously.

[filthy phil]

On 2/2/2024 at 4:45 PM, Sukhoi_fan said:

 

 [one cannot legally use deadly force to protect someone else's property in Texas]). .

Joe horn did it

Edited February 10, 2024 by filthy phil