Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 (edited) I have owned several M4S90's. They have ranged from plane-jane to "decked out", and in-between: The one thing they all shared was that they were the model 11707's. This means: They could accept a 3-position stock. They had interchangeable choke-tubes (Mobil) system, and I needed to replace the magazine tube with a REAL 7-shot tube (I chose a titanium one, from http://www.carriercomp.com). Anyway, I managed to love them, but end up selling them, each in turn. Now...I want another combat shotgun. However, the current 11707 ("Regular" M4S90) and the 11711(Benelli H20) and 11721 ("Police" Benelli w/C-stock) just do not do it for me. You see, I hate interchangeable chokes. You cannot (really REALLY! should not) fire the shotgun without them, and they can and do become loose. Many range instructors can tell you stories about that. Basically, they are just a liability, what with flite-control ammunition, etc. that is out now. So, I wanted an M4S90 without a choke, or rather, screw-in choke. Enter the m1014. This weapon was produced a few years back as an "introduction" to the Benelli M4 to the public, and is identical to the M1014 fielded by the US Marines. It has a heavy, chrome-lined, hammer-forged barrel with a fixed MOD constriction choke. It has a C-stock from the factory--sadly, this C-stock cannot collapse because the receiver extension is not milled for this like the 11707 is. It also has a "neutered" 5-shot magazine tube. Also, it comes with a catch--they were sold years ago, and only 2500 of them were produced/sold to the public. Anyway...I found one. New. Unfired. Buyer only wanted half my soul for it. I plan to run the Mesa Urbino stock, which has a very usable 12.5" LOP (compared to the C-stock or OEM PG stock's 14-3/8" LOP made for apes), as well as a titanium magazine tube, Titanium bolt-handle, and a custom over-sized bolt-release made by me with the help of Kip from http://www.carriercomp.com. I will also likely go with a nice set of Meprolite night-sights I will post pictures in this OP as the project shapes up over the next few weeks, as I create what is in my opinion, the best possible combat-shotgun on the planet short of the AA12. In the mean-time, this is why I am going with an M4 instead of a Saiga. The M4 is smooth...like a Cadillac, and 9 shots should work just fine Edited May 4, 2012 by Unobtanium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 (edited) UPDATE: Update: M1014 arrived today and was fitted with Urbino, and my custom bolt-release, as well as Meprolite night-sights. Still waiting on titanium magazine tube and titanium/A2 composite bolt-handle. Range report: at 45 yards, cheap remington sluggers hold a 3-4" group. At 15 yards, 4shots of 9 pellet remington 00 yielded 35 pellets in about a 12" pattern. At 45 yards, 1oz of #8 game load was evenly patterning, leaving spaces no larger than a business card at worst. So far, very pleased! Shoots slug and buck to same poa. It cycled everything, including 1oz birdshot at 1290fps (which was the first round down the tube, ever, other than factory test-fire. It functioned just fine, ejecting and feeding the next round. The gun smoothed up as the range-session wore on. I do know that I dislike the Limbsaver buttpad. It seems very soft, and I did notice that on some shots the weapon seemed to cycle slower, as I did not pull it in tight to my shoulder when firing the birdshot. The pad being so squishy just added to the issue, but it never failed to cycle and eject and then feed, or lock the bolt back. I will be changing it out for the "regular" pad, though. Edited May 4, 2012 by Unobtanium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1014 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 totally cool pics man,,welcome back,,I came back about 2 months ago,,groovy times again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12508 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Interesting about the fixed choke. So all M4s except the M1014 lack a heavy wall barrel like the Marine issue gun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookster Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Congrats Unobtanium!! I like your bolt release, was it machined from scratch or made using an existing part? I'd love to hear any more thoughts you have on the Urbino as well, are you totally happy with it other than the Limbsaver? Later, Hookster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerDanger Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Looks great! Interesting about the limbsaver. It may be allowing the weapon to move to the rear more than a harder pad and stealing some of its inertia. Inspect the recoil tube and make sure the inside is polished smooth. The unit I took off of my 11703 was rather rough on the inside. When I swapped the receiver extension out for a newer production one, I noticed it was much smoother on the inside. Swapping out the extension would likely bump up its value, since it would then have the functional telescopic stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 (edited) Congrats Unobtanium!! I like your bolt release, was it machined from scratch or made using an existing part? I'd love to hear any more thoughts you have on the Urbino as well, are you totally happy with it other than the Limbsaver? Later, Hookster Just got back from shooting about 60 slugs at 200 yards with my former roommate. On what looked like a 14x18" or so plate, we were tagging it every 4th or 5th time. Not bad considering the FSP obscured it due to hold-over. The Urbino disappointing me. I did not crank it down super tight, or use a thread-locker on it, but it came loose. I don't really like that, and will be replacing it with the OEM PG stock, which CANNOT come loose. It may have a slightly less than perfect LOP, but it's plenty serviceable and I prefer ultimate reliability over a slightly more comfortable LOP. My bolt release is a 2-piece affair, made from a CMM latch tapped for 4-40, and a 4-40 button from shooter's connection or someplace that Kip was nice enough to finish for me in addition to another order I had with him. I have had it sitting on the shelf for a year or so, and finally put it to use. Anyway, love the Urbino, and maybe if I really torque it down it would be fine, but it's not a good system to do that with unless Mesa gets rid of the slot-head screw and goes with something that has a hex-head attachment. Slot/phillips screws are far too easy to strip and ding beyond use when you really get after them, or try to un-do them after using a thread-locker. Thus, OEM PG is going on the weapon. Using STS 2.75 DRAM target-loads (1-1/8 oz at 1175fps, as I understand it) to function test, the weapon fired, cycled, and locked the bolt back on the last round with them. Speaking of smooth vs. rough, I noted that the "bores" the pistons ride in on this M1014 are very smooth. The one's on my last 11707 were notably "ridged". Both work fine. I have not looked in the extension, as it cycles anything I put in it well, even with the limbsaver. The 2-piece mag-tube is crap, and keeps coming loose where the aluminum meets the steel extension part, and turning a bit in the receiver as well. Cannot wait for the Ti version from Kip! I sold the C-stock for $385 shipped, as it has a visible defect from the factory (pit from casting). As I understand it, all M4S90's have roughly the same barrel. The extension on the 11707's is slightly different as it has a shoulder at the front of the receiver, and the inner-most part has a "wing" to the right while the M1014 does not. Benelli USA could not answer for this, and said they were aware of no M1014 issues that arose at any point from not having these things. Mine has not worn the receiver in any untoward way, and accuracy with slugs is similar/identical to my 11707's. The barrels are almost identical other than that, and the 11707 being tapped for a choke. Both are the same "gauge" walls, as far as I know. The fixed MOD choke seems to pattern pretty well, though. 12" is about the norm for it at 15 yards with 00 Remington Buck (not the best...I have some Ranger HD and 000 Remington en'route). Edited May 4, 2012 by Unobtanium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerDanger Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Sucks to hear about the Urbino. You outlined many of the issues I had with it. I would not put thread locker on the fastener though. You will end up unscrewing the entire plug when it comes time to remove the stock for whatever reason. There are a few threads from last year where guys had to cut the Urbino stock open in order to recover the receiver extension's plug due to the use of blue locktite. A couple guys have chopped down the factory pistol grip stock, you might want to look into that for going with a shorter LOP. Or perhaps try a Field Stock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Sucks to hear about the Urbino. You outlined many of the issues I had with it. I would not put thread locker on the fastener though. You will end up unscrewing the entire plug when it comes time to remove the stock for whatever reason. There are a few threads from last year where guys had to cut the Urbino stock open in order to recover the receiver extension's plug due to the use of blue locktite. A couple guys have chopped down the factory pistol grip stock, you might want to look into that for going with a shorter LOP. Or perhaps try a Field Stock? I believe the field-stock has the same LOP. I prefer the PG stock to a field stock, ergonomically, but that's a personal call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookster Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Yea it's too bad the Urbino did not live up to all our expectations. I'm an "ultimate reliability" over all else guy as well. It sure would be nice if Benelli offered a shorter LOP stock option. Later, Hookster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Just think of the OEM stock as having the muzzle another @2" closer to the target Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookster Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Just think of the OEM stock as having the muzzle another @2" closer to the target You're right!.... Now maybe I can hit something with that sucker.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 You're right!.... Now maybe I can hit something with that sucker.... Realistically though, the further your eye is from the rear and front sight, the less of the target the FSP will obscure, and the more precise the rear ghost-ring will be to use. This sadly makes it a tick slower in exchange for the possible increase in user-friendliness regarding accuracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookster Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Realistically though, the further your eye is from the rear and front sight, the less of the target the FSP will obscure, and the more precise the rear ghost-ring will be to use. This sadly makes it a tick slower in exchange for the possible increase in user-friendliness regarding accuracy. Agreed.....Everything is a trade-off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhoi_fan Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Is that a 2 port or 4 port barrel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Is that a 2 port or 4 port barrel? 2-port. The 2.75 dram stuff barely eased out. I would say it popped out about 18", but the bolt locked back and it cleared the weapon and it's a combat shotgun shooting 2.75 dram target loads! I have fired about 75 slugs through it so far. Inspection of the Carrier face where the pistons impact show wear (polishing) consistent with my former 11707's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM4robbins Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 2 port good, 4 port bad. Sounds like a lizard's tail. Every time you sell an M4, it grows back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Range Report #3: The Federal DPRS slugs are very inaccurate in this gun, and my roommate's 590A1. We get tighter "patterns" with buckshot almost. Very poor accuracy from the new Federal offering. I will stick with 1oz Remington Sluggers. They shoot 3-4" groups at 50 yards rather handily, and I can connect with a torso at 200 yards as previously mentioned with startling frequency. The Winchester 9-pellet full-power Ranger Buckshot on the other hand, is stellar! Here is a 5-shot target at a bit over 40 yards: That's a bit over 40% payload in a 12" circle at 40 yards. (3.7 pellets per trigger pull avg.) 57% payload in a 14x18 inch target at 40 yards. (5.1 pellets per trigger pull). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Have you tried the Winchester PDX1 12 ga 00 buck/slug round? I haven't tried it out of my 11707 yet but did try it out of my Super Nova tactical with good results. This was at 20 yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Have you tried the Winchester PDX1 12 ga 00 buck/slug round? I haven't tried it out of my 11707 yet but did try it out of my Super Nova tactical with good results. This was at 20 yards. Nice pattern! For my intent, though, I want either a slug or buckshot, not really both. Slugs are for "precision" or long-range shots, and buckshot is for up close w/reduced penetration characteristics. Using the PDX1 negates this last up close, and is just a liability further out. I was shocked at how well the Ranger's patterns held up at the 40 yard line. Slugs are lethal accurate out to 200 yards, too. Hope to keep this tail! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Fab Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Gotcha. I was just throwing it out there mostly as a defense option. This round, for me, is PD for the home designed to just make it happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobtanium Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Gotcha. I was just throwing it out there mostly as a defense option. This round, for me, is PD for the home designed to just make it happen. I have no doubt that it will change someone's channel and break the remote! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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