StrangerDanger

Expect it to go back up. I'd rather the collapsible than the Urbino. Even if you hate the stock, you can sell it for more than you paid down the road.

Gotcha. Hopefully it is an old stock photo. I'll find out. GG&G pad and a SideArmor top rail. The older lighter version.

January 18 - 21, 2011

I really hope the tube is a 3 position one. I'll let you know when it arrives. My guess is a week since it's coming from NY. I wasn't aware of a revision at some point where the tubes were changed from a 2 to a 3 point. Is the issue that you're avoiding violating the 922? I splurged on the stock, a VCAS padded sling, an oversized safety and a MEsa tactical QD sling mount for the collapsible stock. It's going on the one with the Aimpoint.

I forgot to mention. All the threads on the recoil extension and receiver nut are common thread. Lefty loosy. Also, be sure to clean the extension before you heat it unless you like a smoke filled room from all the oil burning. BreakFree worked well at blasting it out. If you're considering buying a collapsible stock, you had better get one from HK while they're at 250$. That price probably won't last more than a day or two. You'll be crying when the price climbs back to the 400$ range.

I'll take a look when I get there. Pretty sure my boss is sending me again.

All that sounds like a lot of work to replace a 60$ part. Breaking the locktite on 2 guns? No thanks! I do hope the rebate program will come back though.

No problem. I searched on here as well and couldn't find much about the process. I had heard that it was impossible or needed a gunsmith to get off. If my cheap heatgun can do it, I'm sure anyone can with the right tools. I also considered going the buy/sell upgrade route to avoid the trouble. The job is easy enough that it isn't worth the trouble. Unless you wanted a newer model M4 anyway. What I would do is try to get yours off. Then buy the replacement tube if successful. Heatguns are cheap. A 1 1/16 wrench is kind of an odd size, but I happened to have one. Everyone should have snap ring pliers. The rest are common tools. I'll snap some pictures. I was going to document the disassembly process, but my camera was dead. Depending on how many rounds you have through the shotgun, you might want to consider replacing the recoil spring while you're in there.

That was my guess at first when looking at the site. What I think it is is a stripped receiver extension vs a complete unit. Ie: the tube, spring, plunger, spring retainer and snap ring. In both pictures, you can see the full length flat spot on the extension. This flat spot is what allows the stock to slide to the different positions. The grooves you see are what locks the stock into a specific point. These extensions offer three fixed points. 1. Fully closed 2. A middle position that offers a LOP similar to the Urbino 3. Fully extended like the fixed pistol grip stock I hijacked my own thread about the disconnector sucking. I removed the receiver extension a few days ago. It's not an easy job. Taking off a mag tube is significantly easier. It took an hours worth of heat from my heatgun to break the locktite. Disassemble the weapon. Remove the snapring from the base of the recoil extension. Unscrew the spring retainer. Use a punch to retain the recoil spring through the drainage holes while you remove the spring retainer. After the spring retainer comes out, carefully contain the spring as you pull out the punch. Then remove the plunger by tipping the extension downward. Put the receiver in a padded vice. I clamped down below the rear sight. Do not crush the receiver. Just tighten it enough to hold it in place. I'd remove tritium rear sights before heating the receiver too. Apply heat to the 1 1/16" nut liberally. This took about 25 minutes with a heatgun. A torch would be faster, but I didn't have one. The heatgun is probably safer too. Don't apply a lot of torque to the nut. You don't want to twist the receiver. I used one hand to apply my torque with a 12" closed wrench. Once it gives up, unscrew it and slide it off of the receiver extension. Now, continue heating the receiver extension where it screws into the receiver. This took another 25 minutes. I used a 3/4" open ended wrench on the flat spots at the end of the receiver extension. Once it starts moving, the battle is won. I only used one hand to apply my torque. Care must be used so you don't mar the flat spots of the tube. The extension has a lot of locktite on it. The threads are deep too. Much more mating surface area than the mag tubes. Once you get the extension off, the receiver will be filled with powdered white/green locktite. I used BreakFree Powder Blast to flush all the debris out. It also helps to cool the receiver quickly so it can be handled. I used a wire brush and some acetone on the threads to remove residual locktite. Now I'm waiting for my new extension for reassembly. I plan to use a small amount of blue locktite. The biggest challenge I forsee is I believe the extension must be timed so the collapsible stock will be indexed correctly. The receiver nut then holds it in place. I don't think you just bottom the extension out. I could be wrong though. Having the collapsible stock on hand should make this fairly easy. I opted for a complete new assembly since my M4 has 13,000 rounds cumulatively on it. If the stripped unit is the same extension body, your upgrade solution could be fairly inexpensive. Last night I tried to see if the pointy cheek piece was an issue with the collapsible stock. You'd have to be a giraffe to get your head that far forward. Or, holding the weapon completely wrong. With a solid hold for me, my cheek indexes with the center screw on the top of the comb. Even with armor on, this isn't an issue. I'm a pretty good sized guy. 6'2" at 180 lbs. I can't see how midgets would have any issues. Maybe if you're 7' tall, and have a massive head, you might have a problem? To me, this argument is moot and shouldn't even be considered a negative point about using the collapsible stock.

This is pretty easy. 11717: Tan M4 11724: 14" Entry gun version 11707: Common M4. If it has the 3 collapse points, you have this model. The side of your original box will say also.

Negative. I have two 11707's and they have the three notches. Collapsed, Middle position and fully extended. The following models are equipped with the 3 position tubes. 11707 11717 11724 The 11703 and the M1014 models have the old recoil tube extension that only has the fully extended position. That is how the M1014's were allowed to be sold with the collapsible stocks in the US. The stock was a real deal collapsing stock, but the recoil extension was NOGO. Without the long flat cut down the length of the recoil extension, there is no chance for the stock to collapse. Here are the links to the replacements. I bought a complete assembly to avoid revision issues if any are present. http://www.gunpartscorp.com/catalog/Detail.aspx?pid=983200&catid=10315 http://www.gunpartscorp.com/catalog/Detail.aspx?pid=1049680&catid=10315 I also recall seeing these tubes for sale on gunbroker a year or two ago selling for ridiculous sums of money. Like 250 - 300 bucks. I bet they bought them here at Numrich. I had a hard time finding this for sale.

Got mine today. Couldn't be any happier. Brand new. Not a mark on it. Thanks!

Also not that familiar with your particular model. How many rounds are on the weapon? Some of your issues sound like you have a weak recoil spring. This is often the issue when the bolt won't fully close. In cold condions, this can be more apparent. Oil and debtors in the recoil tube can seize up and restrict the movement. If you have a gunshop near you that has a similar model, go try it and see if pulling the bolt to the rear offers the same resistance. The springs are cheap and should be replaced every 5,000 rounds. Take the recoil tube apart and clean it out. After 10,000 rounds on mine, the debris collected poured out like coffee for 45 seconds when I sprayed BreakFree Powder Blast in it. If I understand you, you're saying there is a lot of play in the shell elevator? Any chance you could send this weapon back to Benelli for warranty work? You could try buying replacement springs and pins from Brownells, but the trigger pack isn't the nicest thing to disassemble. Also, does your issue happen through a variety of ammunition?

That might work if it'll fit in that small of an area. Mostly the spring contacts the tube walls. Very little of the plunger contacts. Surface finishing would be the best solution. The design is really slick. There is very little side loading even though there is a huge geometry change in the cyclic motion. The pivot point on the cup of the plunger spreads the load while the recoil spring centers the plunger.

I just bought one of those for 110$ from numrich arms. My old 11703 has the recoil extension that doesn't allow a collapsible stock to collapse. It's a real PITA to get off, but I managed. Most are rocking 11707's or higher, so they don't have this problem.

200 dollar tubes refers to the factory 2 round extensions that typically fetch 200$. Kip is the owner of carriercomp who makes a 200$ (roughly) titanium full length magazine tube that weighs 5 ounces less than a steel unit. I don't expect these prices to stay this low. Right now there is a lot of supply. When it dries up, the prices will creep up. I have been debating on which stock to get for my M4 for quite a while. There was no way I was going to pay 400+ dollars for a collapsible stock from Benelli. On my shotgun, the cost is higher since I had to buy a new recoil spring extension with the appropriate machining to allow the stock to collapse. That's an extra 100$ right there. There is a lot of backbiting about the Urbino. Issues like overly tight fitting do not concern me. The requirement to use tools to remove the stock on a weapon that was designed to be tool free irked me. Ask yourself, with Kip Carrier design it that way? The answer would be an emphatic no. I believe these types of issues led to the price slashing we saw before the release. The pointy cheek piece of the collapsible stock is seriously overhyped. The majority of users encounter no issues. The ergonomics of the pistol grip are the same as the pistol grip fixed stock. The Urbino stock has a slightly different feel to it. Most claim the grip is boxy compared to the factory models. The collapsible stock will give you two strikes if you care about 922 compliance. Where as the Urbino would count towards compliance. There are enough compliance parts coming on the horizon to make even the collapsible stock compliant. At the 250$ price point, I'd opt for the collapsible stock all day long. At the old 450 - 750$ price range, I'd consider the Urbino instead, or stick with the pistol grip fixed stock. I did buy a Mesa Tactical QD sling attachment for the collapsible stock though.

Good stuff. The price is very reasonable too. Anything at or under stock weight is good to go. When do you expect to start selling them? I am planning to buy three. Also, I saw the solidworks renderings of the FIST in your gallery. Very interesting looking. Is there a method of retracting the bayonet? Such as reversing it in its mount?

Weighed the recoil extension on my postal scale. It is 6.4 ounces.

Hey Kip, The extension itself seems pretty straight forward to make. It's roughly 21mm in diameter and has an ID of approximately 16mm. The metric sizes seemed to make more sense for the italian gun. There is a cheap fixed snap ring in the end of the unit that prevents the plunger from pushing all the way through. The machining on this steel extension looks like a hack job compared to the work I've seen on your magazine tubes. With your own tubes, you could set where you think the LOP should be on the collapsible stocks.

My M4 was purchased in 2004. It is a 11703 model. Which has the gay recoil extension that the M1014 has. This prevents the collapsible stock from collapsing. Since I just scored an awesome price on a collapsible stock (thanks HK), I figured it was time to upgrade this part. I just came downstairs from my lair. The extension is history. It took me about an hour or so to break it free. I was worried it wouldn't give up the ghost very easily. I used a basic heat gun and roasted the **** out it. I rigged up the receiver in my vice and placed the heat gun so it would cook the extension near the receiver without me holding it. You should take the recoil spring, recoil spring plug and the plunger out before roasting it to avoid damaging the spring mainly. This is pretty easy to do. At the base of the extension, use a pair of snap ring pliers to remove the snap ring. Then unscrew the recoil spring plug. It should be pretty easy to unscrew. It takes an odd shaped screw driver head. I just used the snap ring pliers points. The 1 1/16 nut at the base of the receiver twists off normally. Lefty loosy when looking at the receiver from the top, extension pointed towards you. Common threading. It took about 20 minutes of heat to get the nut off. This is why older posts opted for a torch. There is no way in **** a bic lighter would give you enough heat to do this job like I saw for another model of Benelli. Then, it took another 20 minutes or so on the receiver extension to break it free. I used a 3/4" wrench on the flat spots on the extension. This was the hardest part to remove, since Benelli didn't give us a very solid wrenching surface. This also uses the lefty loosy thread patterns. I mention this because when you're trying to break locktite, it really would be nice to know which direction you should be twisting. The receiver has the same green locktite that the magazine tube extension has. There is just a lot more thread to deal with. Hence the perception that it is harder to remove than the magazine extension. I'd rate that it is harder to do. But not seriously hard. Also, I noted that the locktite did not smoke like the magazine tube extension does. I gave the receiver a bath in BreakFree Powder Blast after the extension was removed. The threads were pretty clean. Tools: Vice (Mandatory) Heat Gun or Torch (Mandatory) Snap Ring Pliers (Mandatory) 3/4" Open Ended Wrench (Mandatory) 1 1/16" Closed Ended Wrench (Mandatory) Wire Brush (Recommended) Spray Solvent (Recommended) The receiver extension doesn't weigh as much as I had expected. I'll try to weigh it tomorrow at work on our postal scale. However, I'd guess that it weighs about 8 ounces. I was kind of worried that I wouldn't be able to get it off myself. I'd say that using a heatgun is probably the safest way to remove the tube since you're using a lower controlled amount of heat opposed to roasting it with a propane torch. Just be sure to pick a good vice point, use padding and do not force it. It will take some force to remove the extension, but enough heat will get the job done.

Plus you might actually get the stock from heckler&hoch. Dealing with botach is seriously hit or miss.

I'll weigh this when it arrives. I might send it out for coating before installing it.

Seems the M4 collapsible stock market pulled a US Housing Market 2008.

I'll take it.

Kip has a good rapport with Wolff. And has the sales volume to make it happen.