Liberty or death Jr.

It should hammer your shoulder, not your finger. Like Full bore said, tighten your grip, and tuck it good and tight into your shoulder, should fix the problem.

I thought the purpose of a training book/dvd is to show you techniques on how to train a dog, ie., how to get him to bring the dummy all the way to you, how to introduce him to water, ect. and you used those techniques until the dog has them down pat. I didn't know they had an expected completion time.

No, but I don't think he uses this forum anymore, I will try though, thanks.

All I have noticed, is that the 3-1/2s put more pellets in the bird. 3" seem to have a little bit higher velocities, only about 50 fps though. I use 3-1/2 #2 and #3 winchester HV for ducks and geese, but I do mostly pass shooting. When I want a little extra range, 3" winchester supremes seem to outdistance the 3-1/2 HVs. Hevi shot though seems to out do them all, 3" or 3-1/2. My brothers 10 gauge does awesome for high flying geese, and I have never seen a 3" 10 gauge shell, I do believe they used to make it though.

Oh, my bad, I deleted it from my Photobucket album, be with you in a minute. That should do it.

Another thing, why a million man march or letters? Last I checked, there were 80 million gun owners in the US correct? Thats a bigger voice doncha think?

One thing I have to say about the NRA, as supportive and as much as I am thankful for what they are doing, have any of you noticed that when you send them money, you get 8-10 phone calls from them asking for more? Mr.Military, I agree with you in every way, but I'm with Tucker on this one too.

Time table oriented? I'm gonna have to have to get the dvd or book and see what you are talking about.

Just a question, what A$$ hole has the right to limit our guns? Last I checked we have the right to keep and bare arms, who has the right to say what should be legal or not legal with a gun? If the government has it, we shouldn't be denied that right.

I think I will stick with Wolters, I've heard to many good things about it, thanks though. I should have plenty of time to train him. Sdkidaho, it looks like I have to wait a minimum of 6 months to get the PP, I'm willing to wait because this is the dog I want, but that kinda sucks that I have to wait that long, this waterfowl season will still be fun though. Thanks

That is what I was talking about. I know upland is this fall, but I'm not really worried about it, I hunt waterfowl way more then pheasant hunting, I pheasant hunted maybe 4 times last year and I think I shot 3 total. I will train him next year for that kind of hunting, but I'm gonna concentrate on waterfowl, unless it could have a negative impact if I wait. I'm still trying to call him, his phone has been busy, I'm going to ask him if I should work on both, or if it is okay to wait on the upland. But another reason I wanted this kind of dog is because I want to move to Texas when I move out, and they have quail, pheasant, doves, pigeons, ducks, geese and whatever else I can hunt, I wanted a dog for all around hunting, thats why I liked the PP so much.

Well once a dog is trained, do you just leave it that way, or do you continue to work with him on the off season? The reason I don't want to start with point work, is because all I am worried about this fall is waterfowl so I can just focus on water training, then, I have all next summer to work him on pointing, but if I have to do both for the first year, I will.

Does anyone know where I can find these grips, shown in the middle of the red rectangles? Sorry for using your picture simpink, but I can't find these grips anywhere else.

Yeah, I'm definately getting the books before the dog. He never specified any good training books, he just said they are all kinda the same. He probably hasn't read one in the longest time so he can't really comment on a good book. I'll ask him if I need to work on pointing first, but he mentioned they are just as good of a water dog as they are a pointer, so I don't think it matters which you start with, I'll ask anyway. I want to stick with Wolters just because I have heard so many good comments on it, but no one has specified which would be best for training a water dog and a pointer, I know it will probably be 2 seperate books, so its probably going to be water dog and ??? whichever one is for training a pointer.

Well I have a bit of a bonus on school, I am homeschooled and I graduate next year. Which book or books by Wolters do you guys reccomend? The gun dog focuses on upland and water, and the Water dog, focuses on water and upland. I want him to be a water dog, and a pointer, this first year I am going to concentrate on water retrieval and next year is when I will get into pointing and upland hunting. I don't have the money to pay someone to train him. I looked it up and it can run up in the thousands.

What did the training cost you, and did it have any affect on "bonding" with the dog? And what kind of reinforcement do you do with him?

I would go with heavy shot #4 or #6, I don't like shooting anything bigger then a #4 through my 20 gauge but its your choice. Its like shooting T shot steel out of a normal bore 12 gauge. I used a 20 gauge for my first year of duck hunting and it did great, I forgot what shells I used with it though, sorry.

Hey guys, more on dogs. First off, where do you guys find the time to train your dogs, my uncle who has trained many dogs, told me they need attention everyday, training that is. I don't have a real job yet, I mostly do handy man work, but I may be getting a real job soon, you know 9-5 or more likely 7:30-6:00 and in winter it gets dark before 6:00 . So how do you guys find the time for it? My uncle also suggested I go to an obedience class when I get him, and then find someone who will help me train him for hunting. He can't help me that much because he is in Washington and I'm in Montana. Did you guys use books or did you take a class with your dog when you first started training? Thanks

If you can find me one, let me know.

Sorry, I'll be more careful next time, I just want to be legal when I get a gun and to be able to trick out my gun the way you guys do and still be fine. I think any law on guns is Bull s**t We should be allowed to do what we want with any gun. I personally would like a grenade launcher on the bottom of my shotgun, that would be SWEET!

Oh, and the one it the second post is completely legal as I read, its the one with the pistol grip stock and the mag extension.

I read it three or four times in this thread. http://www.benelliusa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12995 Care to chime in?

So with the stock on this gun, http://www.benelliusa.com/firearms/large/m4PGSynthetic12Ga.jpg I can't add a mag extension unless I replace some of the parts with US made parts? Wouldn't that mean that just about everyone with an M4 is illegal?

Hey M1014, how is your M4 legal? I just read that you can't have the pistol grip stock and the mag extension together, what did you do to make it legal? Thanks

Says no to what? The pistol grip stock, or the mag extension, or only them put together?